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Administration latest news

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1Administration latest news Empty Administration latest news on Wed Dec 04 2019, 10:36

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
Paul Appleton's latest statement has been filed at Companies House and will be available to see shortly.

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The sale to FV seems to have been the only way to avoid liquidation but will it tell us how much FV agreed to pay for the assets (Cost £46m, book value £27m) and how its to be paid for?

Will it explain why the amounts owed to creditors in 2019 were less (according to the Administrator) than they were in 2017 (according to the auditors)?

2Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 04 2019, 17:14

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Paul Appleton's latest statement has been filed at Companies House and will be available to see shortly.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

The sale to FV seems to have been the only way to avoid liquidation but will it tell us how much FV agreed to pay for the assets (Cost £46m, book value £27m) and how its to be paid for?

Will it explain why the amounts owed to creditors in 2019 were less (according to the Administrator) than they were in 2017 (according to the auditors)?

I still can't understand what FV's plan is?

If they really have committed £27m to buy the club they aren't going to get that back anytime soon in the third (or maybe even the fourth) tier of league football.

They aren't here to throw their money away, so the most be some objective in mind for them to make a decent return on their investment - and I for one can't see that being from the football side of the business.

3Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 04 2019, 17:50

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Their one and only goal is to get us into the premier league ASAP. It has to be. 

With what they have invested so far it shows that they are committed long term and not here to try and make a quick buck or two.

4Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 05 2019, 09:15

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Paul Appleton's latest statement has been filed at Companies House and will be available to see shortly.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

The sale to FV seems to have been the only way to avoid liquidation but will it tell us how much FV agreed to pay for the assets (Cost £46m, book value £27m) and how its to be paid for?

Will it explain why the amounts owed to creditors in 2019 were less (according to the Administrator) than they were in 2017 (according to the auditors)?

I still can't understand what FV's plan is?

If they really have committed £27m to buy the club they aren't going to get that back anytime soon in the third (or maybe even the fourth) tier of league football.

They aren't here to throw their money away, so the most be some objective in mind for them to make a decent return on their investment - and I for one can't see that being from the football side of the business.
Appleton's statement can be viewed now.

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Quite a bit of blame game going on but it doesn't really elucidate why the amounts included in their original statement was £7m less than Fildraw claimed they were owed or £5.9m less  than Anderson claimed he was owed (and owed to Fildraw).

It also doesn't tell us, at first glance, how much more the Davies family or how much Brett Warburton have been obliged to write off or when they can expect to be paid anything.

Doesn't look like there's very much initial cash involved at all but enough to keep the show on the road for the timebeing and operating losses are bound to be big even on low budget players wages.

Hotel administrator hasn't filed his progress report yet.

5Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 05 2019, 13:09

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Thank you Ten Bob, an interesting read (if you like that sort of a thing, which I do).

A couple of points I noticed, the Administrators have charged £1.2m for their services to date (page 4), with other costs of contractors they've employed that include agents to deal with the players (CLL) costing another £670k more (p.8 ).

I wonder if the point you are making about Fildraw and Anderson somehow revolve around the word 'outstanding' which the Administrator used to describe both these secured creditors amounts owed at the time he was appointed?  I'm reading into that, that there was higher amounts that had been secured but had somehow been 'taken off the table in some way'?

Maybe Eddie didn't give Ken a further £5m to settle BluMarble but reduced his security claimed by that much which in turn allowed Ken to put in £5m of his own to secure against the now £5m worth of 'freed up assets' (I've always had problems understanding how Anderson supposedly secured this £5m 'personal' loan to him, on assets that had already been fully secured against???).

Maybe the Administrator ruled that something like this occurred and thus struck out the £5m (and a further £2.5m loan made to KA from Eddie) and similarly the amounts claimed by Anderson supposedly as secured loans on the back of them?

All guess work on my part though?

Another thing that caught my eye was that the club paid for KA's lawyers to fight the frivolous court action by Bassini which injuncted the sale of the club.

Finally the Administrator has submitted a report on the investigation of the Directors (which have only ever been KA, his wife for a time and Holdsworth initially) which may or may not also include 'potential asset recovery' (p.11) - watch this space I guess?


I look forward to the continuation of the saga in due course and hopefully comprehending why FV bought the club/hotel and where they are going financially with it?

6Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 05 2019, 19:51

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Bolton Wanderers report reveals more details of administration

THE procedure of dissolving a long-standing associated Wanderers company continued today with the publication of an administrators’ report on Companies House.

The Bolton Wanderers Football and Athletic Company Limited, which first came to be at the turn of the 20th century, is going through the process of liquidation after Football Ventures assumed control of the ‘golden share’ which confirms membership of the EFL as part of August’s takeover.
It is expected that liquidation will begin in the next couple of months.

As part of his duties, administrator Paul Appleton, working on behalf of Rubin and Partners, issued a statutory six-month progress report to the High Court which revealed several financial details associated with the sale of the club.

A total £1,200,000 will eventually be paid to administrators and their advisors.

The sale of Luca Connell, to Celtic, and Josh Magennis, to Hull City, raised a total £502,008.
Just over £700,000 was paid out in solicitors’ fees, including £27,500 to Walker Morris to cover legal costs for former owner, Ken Anderson, in his court battle against Laurence Bassini, who had taken out an injunction which halted the sale of the club.

“Clearly, the setting aside of the injunction was necessary to ensure a successful outcome of the sale of the business and assets,” the report detailed. “This required Mr Anderson’s assistance, which he was reluctant to provide without having his legal costs covered.”

Anderson also walked away with a £237,000 pay-off as part of the sale. Company records disclose that £1,578,042 was left outstanding to the Monaco-based businessman, but the report adds that “Mr Anderson believes the sum outstanding in this regard is circa £7.5m.”

Fildraw Limited, the company responsible for the trust of late owner Eddie Davies, continue to hold a charge over assets and are, according to records, owed just over £10m – although the report continues: “Fildraw believe the sum outstanding in this regard is circa £17m.”

Consulting Logistics Limited, the company hired to undertake discussions with the playing staff, negotiation of contracts and player sales were guaranteed a fixed £30,000 a month for their services, plus bonuses depending on performance.

At present £160,248 has been paid out to the company, whose directors include former Rushden and Diamonds owner, Keith Cousins, with another £510,800 still to be paid.

The report added that CLL was selected on the basis of “their experience, expertise and knowledge in the football industry,” adding that they were “instrumental throughout the sale process.”

Administrators, who had initially felt confident of a quick sale, also noted that “seemingly endless” delays placed massive pressure on the available cash reserves.
“With the new season approaching rapidly, a decision in respect of funding was required,” the report read. “There was simply insufficient funding available to discharge payments due to a number of parties, perhaps most importantly, the playing staff, who would be asked to participate in the first game of the season, due to take place on August 3, 2019.

“As a result, the majority of the funds held in the estate bank account were utilised to discharge the salaries of the playing staff, most of who had refused to participate unless their salaries were paid.
“This placed significant strain on the administration funding, which was exacerbated further by the inability to secure any significant income from other sources.”

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7Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Fri Dec 06 2019, 09:21

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Thank you Ten Bob, an interesting read (if you like that sort of a thing, which I do).

A couple of points I noticed, the Administrators have charged £1.2m for their services to date (page 4), with other costs of contractors they've employed that include agents to deal with the players (CLL) costing another £670k more (p.8 ).

I wonder if the point you are making about Fildraw and Anderson somehow revolve around the word 'outstanding' which the Administrator used to describe both these secured creditors amounts owed at the time he was appointed?  I'm reading into that, that there was higher amounts that had been secured but had somehow been 'taken off the table in some way'?

Maybe Eddie didn't give Ken a further £5m to settle BluMarble but reduced his security claimed by that much which in turn allowed Ken to put in £5m of his own to secure against the now £5m worth of 'freed up assets' (I've always had problems understanding how Anderson supposedly secured this £5m 'personal' loan to him, on assets that had already been fully secured against???).

Maybe the Administrator ruled that something like this occurred and thus struck out the £5m (and a further £2.5m loan made to KA from Eddie) and similarly the amounts claimed by Anderson supposedly as secured loans on the back of them?

All guess work on my part though?

Another thing that caught my eye was that the club paid for KA's lawyers to fight the frivolous court action by Bassini which injuncted the sale of the club.

Finally the Administrator has submitted a report on the investigation of the Directors (which have only ever been KA, his wife for a time and Holdsworth initially) which may or may not also include 'potential asset recovery' (p.11) - watch this space I guess?


I look forward to the continuation of the saga in due course and hopefully comprehending why FV bought the club/hotel and where they are going financially with it?

I don't doubt that Eddie provided the money to pay off BM (about £4.4m) and that it might have been rounded up to £5m to help clear some other pressing debt. The £4.4m is unlikely to have been paid to BWFC or BL but more likely directly to BM possibly via ED's lawyers.

I think Appleton, for reasons best known to  himself, treated the repayment of the BM loan as if it had just somehow disappeared into thin air. It hadn't, it had been replaced by a loan from KA which he, in turn, owed to ED.

Extraordinary that this should have happened and just as extraordinary that nobody (except KA and his legal team) seemed to  notice, but there was clearly a bitter battle going on and KA was not going to be out-foxed or left exposed.

I suspect ED also lent KA £2.5m around December 2017 to keep the club going prior to the Madine sale in January 2018 and these two items comprised the £7.5m KA claims he was owed and that he owed to ED.

8Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Fri Dec 06 2019, 16:35

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Thanks, and I'm sure you are right in what you say.

I was just wondering out aloud really if instead of a 'new' £5m (£4.4m) that somehow the amount had be 'waived' from the amount owed to Eddie as a 'secured' asset and which Anderson put 'back in' from his 'pocket' as a secured loan instead, which was used to settle BM. Thus Fildraw 'believing the £5m (plus the other £2.5m) to still be owed to them, Anderson believing the £5m being owed to him and Appleton ruling that they in effect cancelled each other out.

Appleton must have obviously had his reason for disallowing both and I was simply trying to come up with some logic as to possibly why?

I see we seem again to be largely on our own in having an interest in such things - and more importantly where they lead - FV certainly aren't here just to lose their millions on a whim of theirs just to be owners of a football club - and that most folk are more than happy to live in ignorance of such things.

Their choice of course but I think they are going to be unpleasantly surprised by events someway down the line because I can't see how FV can break even on the football side of things, let alone keep going until we storm back into the Premier League again!

Somethings got to give before that can possibly happen.

9Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Sat Dec 07 2019, 16:11

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Thanks, and I'm sure you are right in what you say.

I was just wondering out aloud really if instead of a 'new' £5m (£4.4m) that somehow the amount had be 'waived' from the amount owed to Eddie as a 'secured' asset and which Anderson put 'back in' from his 'pocket' as a secured loan instead, which was used to settle BM.  Thus Fildraw 'believing the £5m (plus the other £2.5m) to still be owed to them, Anderson believing the £5m being owed to him and Appleton ruling that they in effect cancelled each other out.

Appleton must have obviously had his reason for disallowing both and I was simply trying to come up with some logic as to possibly why?

I see we seem again to be largely on our own in having an interest in such things - and more importantly where they lead - FV certainly aren't here just to lose their millions on a whim of theirs just to be owners of a football club - and that most folk are more than happy to live in ignorance of such things.

Their choice of course but I think they are going to be unpleasantly surprised by events someway down the line because I can't see how FV can break even on the football side of things, let alone keep going until we storm back into the Premier League again!

Somethings got to give before that can possibly happen.

I'm afraid that Appleton's figures do not stack up without the inclusion of ED's loans to KA so I can only think that it was a bizarre tactic that backfired when Anderson appointed Administrators to the hotel.

I'm also wondering whether leaking stuff to the media that everything was agreed when everything was evidently not agreed, another tactic that backfired.

The majority, though, do seem happy to live in blissful ignorance and, as you know, there are a significant number violently opposed to any examination of the true facts.

As for FV's future plans, I'm no wiser than you are. I don't think I ever had much doubt what Ken Anderson's plan was.

10Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Sun Dec 08 2019, 14:41

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Thanks, and I'm sure you are right in what you say.

I was just wondering out aloud really if instead of a 'new' £5m (£4.4m) that somehow the amount had be 'waived' from the amount owed to Eddie as a 'secured' asset and which Anderson put 'back in' from his 'pocket' as a secured loan instead, which was used to settle BM.  Thus Fildraw 'believing the £5m (plus the other £2.5m) to still be owed to them, Anderson believing the £5m being owed to him and Appleton ruling that they in effect cancelled each other out.

Appleton must have obviously had his reason for disallowing both and I was simply trying to come up with some logic as to possibly why?

I see we seem again to be largely on our own in having an interest in such things - and more importantly where they lead - FV certainly aren't here just to lose their millions on a whim of theirs just to be owners of a football club - and that most folk are more than happy to live in ignorance of such things.

Their choice of course but I think they are going to be unpleasantly surprised by events someway down the line because I can't see how FV can break even on the football side of things, let alone keep going until we storm back into the Premier League again!

Somethings got to give before that can possibly happen.

I'm afraid that Appleton's figures do not stack up without the inclusion of ED's loans to KA so I can only think that it was a bizarre tactic that backfired when Anderson appointed Administrators to the hotel.

I'm also wondering whether leaking stuff to the media that everything was agreed when everything was evidently not agreed, another tactic that backfired.

The majority, though, do seem happy to live in blissful ignorance and, as you know, there are a significant number violently opposed to any examination of the true facts.

As for FV's future plans, I'm no wiser than you are. I don't think I ever had much doubt what Ken Anderson's plan was.

Thanks Bob,

Yes indeed, it seems that most people are happy to accept the moment and vehemently oppose anyone questioning what they believe, even when they have absolutely no facts to go on and seemingly believe implicitly what someone says in the local paper or from a wholly self-led by self-interested individuals 'pressure' group such as the ST.

Always the case though that any messenger to the contrary are shot.

11Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Mon Dec 09 2019, 10:27

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Thanks, and I'm sure you are right in what you say.

I was just wondering out aloud really if instead of a 'new' £5m (£4.4m) that somehow the amount had be 'waived' from the amount owed to Eddie as a 'secured' asset and which Anderson put 'back in' from his 'pocket' as a secured loan instead, which was used to settle BM.  Thus Fildraw 'believing the £5m (plus the other £2.5m) to still be owed to them, Anderson believing the £5m being owed to him and Appleton ruling that they in effect cancelled each other out.

Appleton must have obviously had his reason for disallowing both and I was simply trying to come up with some logic as to possibly why?

I see we seem again to be largely on our own in having an interest in such things - and more importantly where they lead - FV certainly aren't here just to lose their millions on a whim of theirs just to be owners of a football club - and that most folk are more than happy to live in ignorance of such things.

Their choice of course but I think they are going to be unpleasantly surprised by events someway down the line because I can't see how FV can break even on the football side of things, let alone keep going until we storm back into the Premier League again!

Somethings got to give before that can possibly happen.

I'm afraid that Appleton's figures do not stack up without the inclusion of ED's loans to KA so I can only think that it was a bizarre tactic that backfired when Anderson appointed Administrators to the hotel.

I'm also wondering whether leaking stuff to the media that everything was agreed when everything was evidently not agreed, another tactic that backfired.

The majority, though, do seem happy to live in blissful ignorance and, as you know, there are a significant number violently opposed to any examination of the true facts.

As for FV's future plans, I'm no wiser than you are. I don't think I ever had much doubt what Ken Anderson's plan was.

Thanks Bob,

Yes indeed, it seems that most people are happy to accept the moment and vehemently oppose anyone questioning what they believe, even when they have absolutely no facts to go on and seemingly believe implicitly what someone says in the local paper or from a wholly self-led by self-interested individuals 'pressure' group such as the ST.

Always the case though that any messenger to the contrary are shot.
The £14m I calculate that FV will be paying for the assets of BWFC includes £5m payable to the EDT Trust payable in 3 years time (relying on my memory here) and £1.85m payable to  Brett Warburton (based on the administrators proposals). Perhaps you could correct me if you suspect either of these may  be incorrect.

There are two statements concerning the administrators of Bolton Whites Hotel filed at Companies House which are presently 'being processed'.

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12Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Mon Dec 09 2019, 11:59

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:The £14m I calculate that FV will be paying for the assets of BWFC includes £5m payable to the EDT Trust payable in 3 years time (relying on my memory here) and £1.85m payable to  Brett Warburton (based on the administrators proposals). Perhaps you could correct me if you suspect either of these may  be incorrect.

There are two statements concerning the administrators of Bolton Whites Hotel filed at Companies House which are presently 'being processed'.

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Appleton's report (page 9) states that £3,064,213 inclusive of interest as been assigned to FVWL as part of the sale consideration  together with the freehold land upon which the charge sits in respect of Mr Warburton.

It goes on to state that £10,050,000 (and not the 17m claimed) is owed to Fildraw and that the amount had been 'compromised' and the balanced assigned to FVWL as part of the sale consideration.

I assumed therefore that Warburton and Fildraw have taken as secured creditors, charges for those amounts against FVWL but on double checking Football Ventures (Whites) Limited's Company House records find that there are no charges as such but are charges against FVWL Football Limited (for the benefit of anyone else who may have interest in such stuff, the charge isn't against the 'umbrella' company FVWL but the company that runs the club itself FVWL Football Ltd - almost identical names when not spelled out in full - but two separate legal entities).  

Both charges are shown as outstanding but I have no idea if any part payment has been made to date.

Hope this information is of some use to you.

Thank you for the heads up that the Administrators required report for the Hotel is being processed - it will be very interesting to read what it says and what if anything, how it matches up to Appleton's!

Wonder what the court order is about too???

13Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Tue Dec 10 2019, 09:57

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:The £14m I calculate that FV will be paying for the assets of BWFC includes £5m payable to the EDT Trust payable in 3 years time (relying on my memory here) and £1.85m payable to  Brett Warburton (based on the administrators proposals). Perhaps you could correct me if you suspect either of these may  be incorrect.

There are two statements concerning the administrators of Bolton Whites Hotel filed at Companies House which are presently 'being processed'.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Appleton's report (page 9) states that £3,064,213 inclusive of interest as been assigned to FVWL as part of the sale consideration  together with the freehold land upon which the charge sits in respect of Mr Warburton.

It goes on to state that £10,050,000 (and not the 17m claimed) is owed to Fildraw and that the amount had been 'compromised' and the balanced assigned to FVWL as part of the sale consideration.

I assumed therefore that Warburton and Fildraw have taken as secured creditors, charges for those amounts against FVWL but on double checking Football Ventures (Whites) Limited's Company House records find that there are no charges as such but are charges against FVWL Football Limited (for the benefit of anyone else who may have interest in such stuff, the charge isn't against the 'umbrella' company FVWL but the company that runs the club itself FVWL Football Ltd - almost identical names when not spelled out in full - but two separate legal entities).  

Both charges are shown as outstanding but I have no idea if any part payment has been made to date.

Hope this information is of some use to you.

Thank you for the heads up that the Administrators required report for the Hotel is being processed - it will be very interesting to read what it says and what if anything, how it matches up to Appleton's!

Wonder what the court order is about too???
Thanks Sluffy. FV have taken on the £3m Warburton debt but it doesn't mean they intend to pay the whole of it. I'd expect that discussions have taken place on this that may or may not be resolved yet.
The Court Order is about the sequence of events. I believe it confirms that the hotel admins were appointed by KA in response to the appointment of Rubins as admins to BWFC. Having digested Rubins reports its not difficult to see why the response was needed.

14Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Sun Dec 15 2019, 22:59

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
The Hotel Administrators report has now been filed.

I've only scanned it but these are some of the things I've noticed so far -

The Hotel and land was sold to FVWL for £6.76m plus stock and equipment £706k giving a total of £7.472m

There were two potential secured creditors Mike James/PBP claim for £5.5m has been settled in full (|£6.48m including interest), but KA received nothing from the hotel but did receive a sum of money that extinguished his claim from the sale of the football club).

Of the remaining balance FVWL paid £441k and will pay the remaining £549k in ten monthly instalments.

Unsecured creditors look to be getting about 15 to20p in the £.

The Administrators have charged £530k for their services so far (page 14).

A report on the Directors behaviour and potential claim for recovery of assets have been filed - but I think this is pretty standard procedure and not indicative that there is something dodgy that has been found.

I don't think I've missed anything major but just in case the link is here for anyone wanting to check -

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15Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Tue Dec 17 2019, 18:14

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
Seems there is agreement with Vince at FGR over the Doidge 'non' transfer -



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16Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 18 2019, 11:09

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Seems there is agreement with Vince at FGR over the Doidge 'non' transfer -



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Pleased to hear that the disputes been settled.



Last edited by Ten Bobsworth on Sat Mar 14 2020, 14:31; edited 3 times in total

17Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 18 2019, 11:15

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:The Hotel Administrators report has now been filed.

I've only scanned it but these are some of the things I've noticed so far -

The Hotel and land was sold to FVWL for £6.76m plus stock and equipment £706k giving a total of £7.472m

There were two potential secured creditors Mike James/PBP claim for £5.5m has been settled in full (|£6.48m including interest), but KA received nothing from the hotel but did receive a sum of money that extinguished his claim from the sale of the football club).

Of the remaining balance FVWL paid £441k and will pay the remaining £549k in ten monthly instalments.

Unsecured creditors look to be getting about 15 to20p in the £.

The Administrators have charged £530k for their services so far (page 14).

A report on the Directors behaviour and potential claim for recovery of assets have been filed - but I think this is pretty standard procedure and not indicative that there is something dodgy that has been found.

I don't think I've missed anything major but just in case the link is here for anyone wanting to check -

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Needs a bit more scrutiny this, Sluffy. Not sure its quite as it appears. PBP paid off in full (including interest) and the ED Trust left hanging on for three years to get less than 30% of the amount it claims to have been owed (after previously writing off c.£185m)?

18Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 18 2019, 12:59

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:The Hotel Administrators report has now been filed.

I've only scanned it but these are some of the things I've noticed so far -

The Hotel and land was sold to FVWL for £6.76m plus stock and equipment £706k giving a total of £7.472m

There were two potential secured creditors Mike James/PBP claim for £5.5m has been settled in full (|£6.48m including interest), but KA received nothing from the hotel but did receive a sum of money that extinguished his claim from the sale of the football club).

Of the remaining balance FVWL paid £441k and will pay the remaining £549k in ten monthly instalments.

Unsecured creditors look to be getting about 15 to20p in the £.

The Administrators have charged £530k for their services so far (page 14).

A report on the Directors behaviour and potential claim for recovery of assets have been filed - but I think this is pretty standard procedure and not indicative that there is something dodgy that has been found.

I don't think I've missed anything major but just in case the link is here for anyone wanting to check -

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Needs a bit more scrutiny this, Sluffy. Not sure its quite as it appears. PBP paid off in full (including interest) and the ED Trust left hanging on for three years to get less than 30% of the amount it claims to have been owed (after previously writing off c.£185m)?

I totally agree it all needs greater scrutinisation, I wasn't feeling my best when I glanced through it but at the same time wanted to post something up for others to see.

I imagine PBP was paid up in full before Fildraw simply because they were the head secured creditor on the hotel.  Maybe if there wasn't the 'hiving off' of the hotel and the Administration was just done by one Administrator then perhaps Fildraw would be the head creditor over all of BL assets and thus be settled in full first with PBP having to wait for three years instead?

Seems that PBP reinvested the money into FVWL Hotel Ltd on the same day (28th August) as the sale of Bolton Whites Ltd - so I guess it was all just in effect a paper transaction and not actually them finally getting their money back in their hand.  Presumably FVWL didn't have the £6.5m to settle the PBP in full - as you have said previously FVWL seems to have spent relatively little cash up front to fund the purchase of the club and hotel from Administration.

I'm beginning to wonder with the 'looking' at how FGR operate and the claim that Sharon Brittan and Emma will be attending the proposed ST's AGM following it's long awaited elections scheduled for the end of January next year, whether part of FVWL vision is to turn us into a parochial backwater footballing club with limited ambitions and funds, centred on localised fan based backing and support.

In which case, God help us.

Do we really want to have a mindset and future existence as a Rochdale or Bury (who have seemingly just applied to join North West Football League at level 9/10 of the footballing pyramid - [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] )?

19Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 18 2019, 13:29

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
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[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:The Hotel Administrators report has now been filed.

I've only scanned it but these are some of the things I've noticed so far -

The Hotel and land was sold to FVWL for £6.76m plus stock and equipment £706k giving a total of £7.472m

There were two potential secured creditors Mike James/PBP claim for £5.5m has been settled in full (|£6.48m including interest), but KA received nothing from the hotel but did receive a sum of money that extinguished his claim from the sale of the football club).

Of the remaining balance FVWL paid £441k and will pay the remaining £549k in ten monthly instalments.

Unsecured creditors look to be getting about 15 to20p in the £.

The Administrators have charged £530k for their services so far (page 14).

A report on the Directors behaviour and potential claim for recovery of assets have been filed - but I think this is pretty standard procedure and not indicative that there is something dodgy that has been found.

I don't think I've missed anything major but just in case the link is here for anyone wanting to check -

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Needs a bit more scrutiny this, Sluffy. Not sure its quite as it appears. PBP paid off in full (including interest) and the ED Trust left hanging on for three years to get less than 30% of the amount it claims to have been owed (after previously writing off c.£185m)?

I totally agree it all needs greater scrutinisation, I wasn't feeling my best when I glanced through it but at the same time wanted to post something up for others to see.

I imagine PBP was paid up in full before Fildraw simply because they were the head secured creditor on the hotel.  Maybe if there wasn't the 'hiving off' of the hotel and the Administration was just done by one Administrator then perhaps Fildraw would be the head creditor over all of BL assets and thus be settled in full first with PBP having to wait for three years instead?

Seems that PBP reinvested the money into FVWL Hotel Ltd on the same day (28th August) as the sale of Bolton Whites Ltd - so I guess it was all just in effect a paper transaction and not actually them finally getting their money back in their hand.  Presumably FVWL didn't have the £6.5m to settle the PBP in full - as you have said previously FVWL seems to have spent relatively little cash up front to fund the purchase of the club and hotel from Administration.

I'm beginning to wonder with the 'looking' at how FGR operate and the claim that Sharon Brittan and Emma will be attending the proposed ST's AGM following it's long awaited elections scheduled for the end of January next year, whether part of FVWL vision is to turn us into a parochial backwater footballing club with limited ambitions and funds, centred on localised fan based backing and support.

In which case, God help us.

Do we really want to have a mindset and future existence as a Rochdale or Bury (who have seemingly just applied to join North West Football League at level 9/10 of the footballing pyramid - [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] )?
You may have noticed that Michael James seems to be keeping his head down. Can't say I blame him but how pleased will he be at smiley Sharon and enchanting Emma cosying up to Dale Vince and Terrence Rigby?
Makes me imagine Caroline Flint turning up to Jeremy Corbyn's leaving do but somehow I can't see her putting her arm round him.

20Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 18 2019, 14:17

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:You may have noticed that Michael James seems to be keeping his head down. Can't say I blame him but how pleased will he be at smiley Sharon and enchanting Emma cosying up to Dale Vince and Terrence Rigby?
Makes me imagine Caroline Flint turning up to Jeremy Corbyn's leaving do but somehow I can't see her putting her arm round him.

It makes me wonder whether there are two separate plans going on here, one to develop the hotel/land at Horwich and the other to perhaps relocate a community based club back in Bolton, or at least significantly lower footballing aspirations in line with financial sustainability primarily funded from attendance and local support.

Maybe James is ok with the latter and PBP got it's eye on the former.

It would make sense of the £40m credit line that has been set up - it's certainly not there to buy footballing success in anything like the short term - and crowds (and thus revenue) will be diminishing the longer the club is not being successful - football fans are notoriously fickle as you know.

That seems to be the only rational explanation I can come up with for a clearly cash limited buyer (FVWL) who had the hotel (and not the club!) central to its business plan, who seems to have £40m backing (why? can't just be on the off chance we get to the Premier League in the next few years!), who are deliberately targeting everything to be Bolton centric (Manager and trainer, Senior Admin staff, friendly overtures with the highly questionable ST, etc, etc) and now possibly looking at footballing models of clubs with low turnovers and no footballing aspirations to speak of.

That's my line of thinking anyway.

21Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 18 2019, 16:11

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:You may have noticed that Michael James seems to be keeping his head down. Can't say I blame him but how pleased will he be at smiley Sharon and enchanting Emma cosying up to Dale Vince and Terrence Rigby?
Makes me imagine Caroline Flint turning up to Jeremy Corbyn's leaving do but somehow I can't see her putting her arm round him.

It makes me wonder whether there are two separate plans going on here, one to develop the hotel/land at Horwich and the other to perhaps relocate a community based club back in Bolton, or at least significantly lower footballing aspirations in line with financial sustainability primarily funded from attendance and local support.

Maybe James is ok with the latter and PBP got it's eye on the former.

It would make sense of the £40m credit line that has been set up - it's certainly not there to buy footballing success in anything like the short term - and crowds (and thus revenue) will be diminishing the longer the club is not being successful - football fans are notoriously fickle as you know.

That seems to be the only rational explanation I can come up with for a clearly cash limited buyer (FVWL) who had the hotel (and not the club!) central to its business plan, who seems to have £40m backing (why? can't just be on the off chance we get to the Premier League in the next few years!), who are deliberately targeting everything to be Bolton centric (Manager and trainer, Senior Admin staff, friendly overtures with the highly questionable ST, etc, etc) and now possibly looking at footballing models of clubs with low turnovers and no footballing aspirations to speak of.

That's my line of thinking anyway.

Have they really got a £40m credit line? If they have (or anything like it), why are the unsecured creditors still having to wait interminably for 35P in the pound and ED's widow even longer than them?

As for the chairman and CEO of BWFC going to Forest Green Rovers to get advice on how to run a football club, I'm afraid words fail me.

22Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Wed Dec 18 2019, 23:22

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Have they really got a £40m credit line? If they have (or anything like it), why are the unsecured creditors still having to wait interminably for 35P in the pound and ED's widow even longer than them?

As for the chairman and CEO of BWFC going to Forest Green Rovers to get advice on how to run a football club, I'm afraid words fail me.

As far as I understand it Sharon Brittan and someone named Nick Luckock have each put a £20m secured charge against Football Ventures (Whites) Ltd, as 'loans' -

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No one seems to know exactly who Luckock is but one bit of trivia no one else seems to have picked up on is that they seem to be neighbours to each other, both living on Church Road, Penn, High Wickham, HP10 8NX (see their respective addresses shown on the documentation for the secured charges).

The only Nick Luckock of any note I can find by doing a simple Google search on his name is this person -

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[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

If it is one and the same person he is a partner at HgCapital and if you look what Hg do, then this is the first line of Wikipeadia's (yes I know) description of the company -

"Hg is a private equity firm targeting middle-market buyouts primarily in Europe".

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It looks as though if it is the same person that it is he that has fronted that half of the investment and not Hg directly, although that's not to say it isn't Hg's money behind him.

I find it incredible to believe that two people unconnected to the club previously are willing to put on the line a large chunk of their personal wealth on a mere punt to turn a financial basket case of a football club around just on the remote off chance that we somehow miraculously become a fixture in the PL in a few years time - so they must have another plan to obtain a return on their money - and that to me can only come from the development of the land the club owns (and sits on?!) and that in turn prompts me to think that maybe relocating the club away from where it is now, to perhaps a scaled down capacity venue in or around Bolton is part of the master plan.

A scaled down new venue and the redevelopment of the Reebok and land would I suggest seem a more reasonable plan for this £40m 'loan' than potentially taking a fourth tier football club next season through all the divisions to the PL, where £10+million transfers (and the salaries that come with them) are common at Championship level, let alone in the PL itself!

Obviously I have no idea what the master plan is, or indeed if I've even identified the correct Nick Luckock but I can't think of a better explanation to fit the few facts we know as to why two people want to put £40m into a football club they had no previous connection with, when there were significantly better clubs available to buy/invest in, if football was there only financial interest.

23Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 19 2019, 08:32

xmiles

xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
Jay Jay Okocha
Sluffy I think your final three paragraphs are the best summary of what is really going on that I have seen. People with no interest in football only put money into a club if they think they can profit from it.

24Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 19 2019, 11:22

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Have they really got a £40m credit line? If they have (or anything like it), why are the unsecured creditors still having to wait interminably for 35P in the pound and ED's widow even longer than them?

As for the chairman and CEO of BWFC going to Forest Green Rovers to get advice on how to run a football club, I'm afraid words fail me.

As far as I understand it Sharon Brittan and someone named Nick Luckock have each put a £20m secured charge against Football Ventures (Whites) Ltd, as 'loans' -

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

No one seems to know exactly who Luckock is but one bit of trivia no one else seems to have picked up on is that they seem to be neighbours to each other, both living on Church Road, Penn, High Wickham, HP10 8NX (see their respective addresses shown on the documentation for the secured charges).

The only Nick Luckock of any note I can find by doing a simple Google search on his name is this person -

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

If it is one and the same person he is a partner at HgCapital and if you look what Hg do, then this is the first line of Wikipeadia's (yes I know) description of the company -

"Hg is a private equity firm targeting middle-market buyouts primarily in Europe".

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

It looks as though if it is the same person that it is he that has fronted that half of the investment and not Hg directly, although that's not to say it isn't Hg's money behind him.

I find it incredible to believe that two people unconnected to the club previously are willing to put on the line a large chunk of their personal wealth on a mere punt to turn a financial basket case of a football club around just on the remote off chance that we somehow miraculously become a fixture in the PL in a few years time - so they must have another plan to obtain a return on their money - and that to me can only come from the development of the land the club owns (and sits on?!) and that in turn prompts me to think that maybe relocating the club away from where it is now, to perhaps a scaled down capacity venue in or around Bolton is part of the master plan.

A scaled down new venue and the redevelopment of the Reebok and land would I suggest seem a more reasonable plan for this £40m 'loan' than potentially taking a fourth tier football club next season through all the divisions to the PL, where £10+million transfers (and the salaries that come with them) are common at Championship level, let alone in the PL itself!

Obviously I have no idea what the master plan is, or indeed if I've even identified the correct Nick Luckock but I can't think of a better explanation to fit the few facts we know as to why two people want to put £40m into a football club they had no previous connection with, when there were significantly better clubs available to buy/invest in, if football was there only financial interest.
I agree that it makes little sense on the face of it.

Brittan and Luckock have registered charges each in respect of £20m 4% loan notes issued (or to be issued?) by FVWL.

Neither of them have significant control. i.e. 25% of the company shares.

In fact no-one seems to own 25% or more of the company and the paid up share capital is a meagre £1.75m.

I suspect we have five shareholders each with a 20% share or thereabouts.

Most of BWFC's debts seem to remain unpaid with money being provided by FVWL on a slow-drip basis with the assets used as security being the ones paid for by Eddie Davies. His widow, it seems, might have to wait three years to get back the last £5m Eddie stumped up just before he died, if she ever does get it back?

What's the plan? They aren't really telling us are they and the 'esteemed' Marc Iles isn't going to ferret it out either but 4% is nowhere near enough a sufficient return on capital if there's a significant risk of not getting some of your capital back.

25Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 19 2019, 12:47

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Sluffy I think your final three paragraphs are the best summary of what is really going on that I have seen. People with no interest in football only put money into a club if they think they can profit from it.

Thanks but it's probably more accurate to call my little musings as surmises rather than summary, as I've no idea how true or accurate they really are.

Seems Wways ownership obviously didn't like my conjecture on the subject though as I seemed to have been banned from there without any warning a couple of weeks back.  

C'est la vie.

It does seem to me though that football alone is not the primary reason that Sharon and Mr Luckock, et al, are seemingly willing to risk millions of their wealth to save little old Bolton Wanderers.

All will be revealed in the fullness of time no doubt, whilst our esteemed journalist bothers himself with constantly promoting his own utterly dreadful podcasts rather than enquires into how the club proposes to fund itself (whilst still making a trading loss) for the forseeable future.

26Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 19 2019, 13:44

Ten Bobsworth


Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Sluffy I think your final three paragraphs are the best summary of what is really going on that I have seen. People with no interest in football only put money into a club if they think they can profit from it.

Thanks but it's probably more accurate to call my little musings as surmises rather than summary, as I've no idea how true or accurate they really are.

Seems Wways ownership obviously didn't like my conjecture on the subject though as I seemed to have been banned from there without any warning a couple of weeks back.  

C'est la vie.

It does seem to me though that football alone is not the primary reason that Sharon and Mr Luckock, et al, are seemingly willing to risk millions of their wealth to save little old Bolton Wanderers.

All will be revealed in the fullness of time no doubt, whilst our esteemed journalist bothers himself with constantly promoting his own utterly dreadful podcasts rather than enquires into how the club proposes to fund itself (whilst still making a trading loss) for the forseeable future.
I got banned too, about the same time. I think it was because Wways mods prefer folk who've never quite grown out of their spotty-faced, potty-mouthed adolescence.

Some of them keep taking a sneaky look on the 'Who funded the building of the Reebok' thread.
Getting on for nearly 3,400 views now but they are all too frit to make any intelligent comment for fear of being banished like the two of us.



Last edited by Ten Bobsworth on Thu Dec 19 2019, 13:56; edited 1 time in total

27Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 19 2019, 13:45

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
I like the idea of a smaller ground somewhere in Bolton.

We'd be a lot better off with a smaller stadium with a capacity of 10-12,000.

28Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 19 2019, 14:27

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:I like the idea of a smaller ground somewhere in Bolton.

We'd be a lot better off with a smaller stadium with a capacity of 10-12,000.
Manchester road?

29Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 19 2019, 14:27

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:I like the idea of a smaller ground somewhere in Bolton.

We'd be a lot better off with a smaller stadium with a capacity of 10-12,000.
Lets just chuck Chorley out of their ground and take it over

30Administration latest news Empty Re: Administration latest news on Thu Dec 19 2019, 14:30

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:I like the idea of a smaller ground somewhere in Bolton.

We'd be a lot better off with a smaller stadium with a capacity of 10-12,000.
Lets just chuck Chorley out of their ground and take it over
But that would make it even further away.

Horwich is a pain as it is.

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