Bolton Wanderers Football Club Fan Forum for all BWFC Supporters.

You are not connected. Please login or register

Bolton Nuts » BWFC » Bolton Wanderers Banter » Next 5 games

Next 5 games

Go to page : 1, 2  Next

Go down  Message [Page 1 of 2]

1Next 5 games Empty Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 14:51

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Word coming out from the dressing room is they they haven't given up on the idea of climbing out of the relegation zone. That might come across as fantasy to some of us, but there are a bunch of new players and after decent performances against Tranmere and high-flying Coventry (bar the defensive cock-ups) perhaps all is not lost? I reckon the next five games will pretty much tell us seeing that on paper at least, 3 of them are "must wins to have any chance whatsoever" despite the congested schedule.
First Doncaster - the club that made every effort to get us a heavier penalty from the EFL. I've nothing against Darren Moore but their chairman is a twat and I hope we stuff them. Currently they're 8th in league and have only lost 1 in their last 5 so it will be a tough, tough challenge but we couldn't have a bigger incentive than them having it in for us.
Then Wycombe at home, 2nd in the league and kicking everyone's butt. A free hit.
After that it's MKD (19th) away, Blackpool (14th) away and Accrington (17th) at home - all of which we really have to win - and if the team really is making the week-on-week improvements that KH talks about, should win.

Five games and giving KH the benefit of the doubt, 10 achievable points IMO - enough to keep the slender hopes of survival going for a while at least - even though we'd still be well short of where we need to be.

2Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 14:58

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Can only see a win against Accy and maybe a point against MK Dons and Blackpool, the rest we will lose.

Still don't think we can survive this season unless we win every game from now till the end of the season which is as unlikely as Sluffy joining the ST.

3Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 15:15

Cajunboy

Cajunboy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
No doubt Gary Madine will get the winner for Blackpool in the 95th minute. 


I've kept kidding myself that if we can just string a couple of wins and draws together we can get the impetuous to climb out of the bottom three. Sadly I now know it's League Two next season.

4Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 15:52

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I've kept kidding myself that if we can just string a couple of wins and draws together we can get the impetuous to climb out of the bottom three. Sadly I now know it's League Two next season.
As do we all but...there are small signs of improvement and the players that we have are good enough to compete now - unlike most of the season to date - and it almost seems as though with a few tweaks e.g. starting quickly, not gifting daft goals and maintaining the aggression we are not a million miles off becoming a winning team.
Painful to watch but there has at least been some improvement - just not enough yet.

5Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 15:55

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
I'm more worried about next season to be honest. We do look better as a team and will end the season looking better than we started but can we keep the current players? Some will be happy to stay no doubt but the vast majority will want to leave and we will have to rebuild again.

6Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 15:58

MartinBWFC

MartinBWFC
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
18 points from 4th bottom, no chance we're staying up, it would take us 11/12 wins out of 17 and MK Dons or Wimbledon to lose almost every game for it to happen, given it up now, here's to kicking some butt in league 2 next season (Hopefully)

7Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 16:05

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
We're going down. We'd need to get on a run of wins to make a fist of staying up, and I honestly don't think they have that in them.
At least we'll start League two on a level playing field, and we can build from there.
To think, we were promoted from League 1 with Sheffield Utd, and look at them now. It's a long road for us, but we have to believe.

8Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 16:07

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
We'll still be under a transfer embargo next season won't we?

9Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 16:11

MartinBWFC

MartinBWFC
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:We'll still be under a transfer embargo next season won't we?
Yes.

10Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 16:12

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
so not so level then  Crying or Very sad

11Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 16:34

Cajunboy

Cajunboy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker

Light relief.

12Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 17:49

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:I'm more worried about next season to be honest. We do look better as a team and will end the season looking better than we started but can we keep the current players? Some will be happy to stay no doubt but the vast majority will want to leave and we will have to rebuild again.

We only have five players who are contracted to stay with us beyond the summer - and four of them haven't even played much for us at all really so far - Delaney, Brockbank, Faal, and Edwards, with only Politic who can only be thought of as regular first team player.

All the loan players we brought in are contracted to their clubs next season, so they won't be joining us unless their clubs pay off their contracts (and they can't find a better team/bigger wage at another club than us!).

The same goes for out of contract players we have who have been regulars, such as Lowe, Mathews, both Murphy's and even the likes of Zuma, Emmanuel and even Darcy - all may find better deals and better wages at other clubs.

I did point out after the January window that I couldn't see any evidence of Moneyball so far, yet Hill confirmed in one of his rambling and mostly incomprehensible interviews that the second half of the season was the next instalment of the new plan.

What plan, I can't see it?

I think we are on a hiding to nothing for the rest of the season in that if the players play well, they will be off to better clubs who have noticed them and if they don't play well, we won't want them next season, even at fourth tier level.

The only silver lining I can see is that Buckley will be fit again by the start of next season - and no one but us seems to want him!

13Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 20:14

BoltonTillIDie

BoltonTillIDie
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:so not so level then  Crying or Very sad
We'd attract players on loan though, we're still a big club & will be certainly be the big fish in League 2.

14Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Mon Feb 10 2020, 20:41

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:so not so level then  Crying or Very sad
We'd attract players on loan though, we're still a big club & will be certainly be the big fish in League 2.

Yes but...

As it stands now we can't pay loan fees next season, so whoever we do pick up on loan would be players that the parents clubs want to 'prove' themselves at fourth tier level, so I guess less of a quality than the ones we had last season.

We will be a big fish at fourth tier level but being a big fish in your respective division doesn't necessarily mean automatic promotion - West Brom and Sunderland both found that out last season when many (including myself) expected it to be a stroll in the park for them.

Maybe I'm being over cautious but as it is now I don't think automatic promotion is a given as many people seem to think it is.

Perhaps the embargo may be relaxed a little bit for next season and/or the imposed wage limit of £2k per week is good money at this level (anybody know if it is?) but if they aren't, then I don't really see us starting the new season head and shoulders in front of everybody else, despite our three wise men (Kenyon, Phoenix and Hill) at the helm.

15Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Tue Feb 11 2020, 01:16

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
One thing about Kenyon, Hill etc is that in a very short period of time (5 months) they have managed to cobble together the best part of two teams of players who are on average borderline L1/L2 quality so they appear to be well connected and capable of operating with a very tight budget so there is some hope if we go down.
Given the number of players they have brought in under these circumstances, you'd expect their to be a higher percentage of donkeys, so I've no complaints about their signings so far and would say they are getting value for money, even if it hasn't quite worked out yet.

That said it can't have gone unnoticed that despite not having a team for the first 6 games and then getting in a new management team (and team) who were effectively starting from scratch, we have 23 points so far this season (from what is effectively 21 games) and had we had Hill and his signings in from the start the pro rata points for 29 games would be 31.7 points which is above the relegation zone. Despite the embargo and tight purse strings, they ain't done a bad job.

But we're getting off topic.
The issue is really about the players and manager believing we can still survive which means purely from a mathematical perspective that they have to a) get to the next level - can they up their game again? and b) get there very soon and start winning games consistently from here on in.

If it's going to happen - as they apparently believe it will - we'll be in for a treat.
They should more or less all be match fit now so it will come down to the manager to get them playing better IF they have the potential to step up.

Or it will all just turn out to be wishful thinking. Next 5 games will tell us.

16Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Tue Feb 11 2020, 15:25

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:One thing about Kenyon, Hill etc is that in a very short period of time (5 months) they have managed to cobble together the best part of two teams of players who are on average borderline L1/L2 quality so they appear to be well connected and capable of operating with a very tight budget so there is some hope if we go down.
Given the number of players they have brought in under these circumstances, you'd expect their to be a higher percentage of donkeys, so I've no complaints about their signings so far and would say they are getting value for money, even if it hasn't quite worked out yet.

That said it can't have gone unnoticed that despite not having a team for the first 6 games and then getting in a new management team (and team) who were effectively starting from scratch, we have 23 points so far this season (from what is effectively 21 games) and had we had Hill and his signings in from the start the pro rata points for 29 games would be 31.7 points which is above the relegation zone. Despite the embargo and tight purse strings, they ain't done a bad job.

But we're getting off topic.
The issue is really about the players and manager believing we can still survive which means purely from a mathematical perspective that they have to a) get to the next level - can they up their game again? and b) get there very soon and start winning games consistently from here on in.

If it's going to happen - as they apparently believe it will - we'll be in for a treat.
They should more or less all be match fit now so it will come down to the manager to get them playing better IF they have the potential to step up.

Or it will all just turn out to be wishful thinking. Next 5 games will tell us.

Fwiw I don't agree with much of the above.

Mathematically we may not be down yet but realistically we are and have been since for whatever reason Hill sent back the two centre backs he had on loan and didn't bother resigning Chicksen when his contract expired and basically didn't replace them until the end of the transfer window.

We picked up just 1 point from a possible 15 in January.

As for how good a judge Hill is of players...

- All his loans signings from the first half of the season did not return - indeed he sent two back himself!

Of the eight players he signed for the first half of the season, he did not re-new the contracts of Chicken or Buckley (he had to later do a U-turn on that).

Bunney has yet to play.

Crawford (injured), O'Grady and Dodoo have been peripheral at best up to now...

...leaving only Emmanuel and Murphy as regular first teamers.

Hardly anything to write home about really, is it?  I'm sure most managers could have achieved similar in the same circumstances.

The truth of the matter really is the backbone of the side during Hills first half of the season has been comprised of the three first teamers he inherited - Matthews, Lowe and the younger Murphy plus the youngsters such as Darcy, Politic and Zuma.

I'm not knocking Hill but I've certainly not been impressed with him, mainly because of the tripe he speaks.

I suspect the plan is for him to "coach, coach, coach.." the players that someone else (the Moneyball team???) brings in.

I don't think Hill is the one ultimately to select the players he wants at the club although it appears (with the signing of Delaney for instance) that he still for now has some say.

The summer window might give us a better idea of what is really going on perhaps?

17Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Wed Feb 12 2020, 00:46

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:One thing about Kenyon, Hill etc is that in a very short period of time (5 months) they have managed to cobble together the best part of two teams of players who are on average borderline L1/L2 quality so they appear to be well connected and capable of operating with a very tight budget so there is some hope if we go down.
Given the number of players they have brought in under these circumstances, you'd expect their to be a higher percentage of donkeys, so I've no complaints about their signings so far and would say they are getting value for money, even if it hasn't quite worked out yet.

That said it can't have gone unnoticed that despite not having a team for the first 6 games and then getting in a new management team (and team) who were effectively starting from scratch, we have 23 points so far this season (from what is effectively 21 games) and had we had Hill and his signings in from the start the pro rata points for 29 games would be 31.7 points which is above the relegation zone. Despite the embargo and tight purse strings, they ain't done a bad job.

But we're getting off topic.
The issue is really about the players and manager believing we can still survive which means purely from a mathematical perspective that they have to a) get to the next level - can they up their game again? and b) get there very soon and start winning games consistently from here on in.

If it's going to happen - as they apparently believe it will - we'll be in for a treat.
They should more or less all be match fit now so it will come down to the manager to get them playing better IF they have the potential to step up.

Or it will all just turn out to be wishful thinking. Next 5 games will tell us.

Fwiw I don't agree with much of the above.

Mathematically we may not be down yet but realistically we are and have been since for whatever reason Hill sent back the two centre backs he had on loan and didn't bother resigning Chicksen when his contract expired and basically didn't replace them until the end of the transfer window.

We picked up just 1 point from a possible 15 in January.

As for how good a judge Hill is of players...

- All his loans signings from the first half of the season did not return - indeed he sent two back himself!

Of the eight players he signed for the first half of the season, he did not re-new the contracts of Chicken or Buckley (he had to later do a U-turn on that).

Bunney has yet to play.

Crawford (injured), O'Grady and Dodoo have been peripheral at best up to now...

...leaving only Emmanuel and Murphy as regular first teamers.

Hardly anything to write home about really, is it?  I'm sure most managers could have achieved similar in the same circumstances.

The truth of the matter really is the backbone of the side during Hills first half of the season has been comprised of the three first teamers he inherited - Matthews, Lowe and the younger Murphy plus the youngsters such as Darcy, Politic and Zuma.

I'm not knocking Hill but I've certainly not been impressed with him, mainly because of the tripe he speaks.

I suspect the plan is for him to "coach, coach, coach.." the players that someone else (the Moneyball team???) brings in.

I don't think Hill is the one ultimately to select the players he wants at the club although it appears (with the signing of Delaney for instance) that he still for now has some say.

The summer window might give us a better idea of what is really going on perhaps?
I guess it comes down to what we could possibly have expected from the position we were in and personally I expected relegation by a country mile. I don't see there was ever any chance of signing players of the quality that would dominate this league and think that the best hope was to sign rejects that are perceived to have the potential to do better than their records suggest and better ones that have been overlooked which they seem to have made their plan.
Given the fact that despite the disadvantages of lack of preseason,
time with a stable team, continuity of playing staff etc they have done better than teams who had all the above.
As regards clawing back the penalty points, the only question for me is whether or not Hill and Flitcroft could get the rejects to exceed what they have done in the past/reach their full potential.
Tonight we were reasonably competitive against a top half team but lost because we gave away 2 soft goals - specifically because the defenders were ball watching instead of keeping an eye on the runners and unmarked attackers - again. (check out recent goals conceded) I'm not questioning their motivation because Hill has got them working, but....
seems to me they have a gung ho attitude towards defending - committed to blocking the immediate threat e.g. the shot on goal (bodies on the line etc) whilst neglecting the second ball/phase options and it seems to be a recurring scenario that the immediate threat is stopped only to fall to an unmarked attacker.
I'd be looking at midfielders tracking back and two defenders going for the same ball to resolve this. Sort out the defence and we could be a threat to many teams in this league.
Expect to lose v Wycombe but after that there are a bunch of winnable games.

PS. "as for how good a judge Hill is of players.....Bunney is yet to play" is not an argument.

18Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Wed Feb 12 2020, 12:27

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:I guess it comes down to what we could possibly have expected from the position we were in and personally I expected relegation by a country mile. I don't see there was ever any chance of signing players of the quality that would dominate this league and think that the best hope was to sign rejects that are perceived to have the potential to do better than their records suggest and better ones that have been overlooked which they seem to have made their plan.
Given the fact that despite the disadvantages of lack of preseason,
time with a stable team, continuity of playing staff etc they have done better than teams who had all the above.
As regards clawing back the penalty points, the only question for me is whether or not Hill and Flitcroft could get the rejects to exceed what they have done in the past/reach their full potential.
Tonight we were reasonably competitive against a top half team but lost because we gave away 2 soft goals - specifically because the defenders were ball watching instead of keeping an eye on the runners and unmarked attackers - again. (check out recent goals conceded) I'm not questioning their motivation because Hill has got them working, but....
seems to me they have a gung ho attitude towards defending - committed to blocking the immediate threat e.g. the shot on goal (bodies on the line etc) whilst neglecting the second ball/phase options and it seems to be a recurring scenario that the immediate threat is stopped only to fall to an unmarked attacker.
I'd be looking at midfielders tracking back and two defenders going for the same ball to resolve this. Sort out the defence and we could be a threat to many teams in this league.
Expect to lose v Wycombe but after that there are a bunch of winnable games.

PS. "as for how good a judge Hill is of players.....Bunney is yet to play" is not an argument.

You're beginning to sound like one of Hill's interviews with all that meaningless waffle.

The post I initially responded to was one of you extolling positive views of how close we could possibly be to staying up, analysing Hill's point per games, extrapolating how they would add up across the season and stating in your opinion how Hill had done a wonderful job in finding the players good enough to possibly pull this off.

Now one game later and after I pointed out the reality of the situation and Hill's recruits, you've changed direction completely to telling us that you expected relegation "by a country mile" and that we could never sign players to "dominate this league" - obviously we couldn't - we are under a two year player embargo of course!!!

I remember you stating your master plan for this season before it even got going over on Wways where you told everyone we should scour the country for youth players and play kids throughout the season - to which I responded to by posting just two words - "utter madness".

Not only would the kids not have the physicality to last a gruelling nine month season (and why the original Doncaster fixture went on to be called off) and that the constant losses and abuse that follows from a goodly portion of the morons that follow ever football team would have effected them too (look at how Matthews seems to have caved into to social media comments recently for example).  Also many but the hardcore fans would quickly write off the season and stop going - what is the point in seeing a bunch of kids get battered every week, which in turn effects the financial position at the club.

Finally, "Bunney is yet to play" is a statement of FACT.  

Clearly you don't allow facts to get in the way of your arguments then!

19Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Wed Feb 12 2020, 13:43

terenceanne

terenceanne
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf
At this moment I can't see us coming back up from League 2 at the first attempt.  The heart would like it to happen but the brain says no for a lot of the reasons stated above.
Mainly because we don't even have a team for next season....the current team is not good enough as it stands and half of them will be off anyhow. So we start over in the summer and who knows what sort of quality can be brought in. The Embargo is in place for at least another season. The EFL has done us in IMO.

20Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Wed Feb 12 2020, 14:11

MartinBWFC

MartinBWFC
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
When you read something like this you have to question Hill's mentality.

Asked if he was frustrated by the errors, Hill added: “You always are. But sometimes you have got to ignore them.
“You make mistakes at home – you keep being told you are making them it takes you into a different place, you’re contemplating ‘why bother?’ “If you keep reminding players all the time about the mistakes they are making they are going to fear going out there. You want them to express themselves and make better decisions but if you keep on asking them it becomes false, it doesn’t encourage. You make them fear.

21Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Wed Feb 12 2020, 14:52

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:When you read something like this you have to question Hill's mentality.

Asked if he was frustrated by the errors, Hill added: “You always are. But sometimes you have got to ignore them.
“You make mistakes at home – you keep being told you are making them it takes you into a different place, you’re contemplating ‘why bother?’ “If you keep reminding players all the time about the mistakes they are making they are going to fear going out there. You want them to express themselves and make better decisions but if you keep on asking them it becomes false, it doesn’t encourage. You make them fear.

Not really, in a way he's right.

You have to start looking at human behaviour and reinforcement of views.

If you are continually told by your boss you make mistakes all the time it is only natural (if you want to keep your job/place in the team) to try to stop making them - and the most obvious way of doing that is to avoid having to make any decisions at all.

Hill's more at fault by starting off by slamming the players right from the start, calling them gym bunnies with no technical skills and belittling them by revealing that non of them could keep 'header uppies' with him more than a few goes whilst him and 'Flicker' (I find such a nickname deeming personally and would not respond to it if I was Flitcroft - how hard is it to say David, or Dave?) could keep it up all day.  Good for them but I've never seen header uppies win any game yet.

Hill's job is to coach what he's got, no matter what deficiencies they currently have.  

He should have come up with a system and clearly defined roles for players by now, such that everyone should know and understand what they are meant to be doing team wise.

Does anyone we goes watching the team see any evidence of this because it seems numerous changes in defence are producing individual errors, possibly/probably because these individuals haven't a clearly defined system that they can slot in and out of when selected for the team - hence Hill's constant complain of individuals making poor choice selection leading to errors?

At the end of the day we know the level of footballers we have are with us because they either aren't that great or have seen better days or just youngsters coming through the system.  The job of the manager is to build a synergy from this being the team is better than the sum of the individual players.

Despite Hill's own individual mistakes such as blasting the youth players skills publicly, he seemed to be achieving this somewhat until the recent transfer window when something clearly happened behind the scenes and nothing has been the same since.

Hill would be better advised to move away from being the one to be the face of the public face of the club, Flitcroft could hardly do a worse job could he, and concentrate building this synergy from the players he has at his disposal.

I'm no Hill lover but I can't see him being sacked this season - what's the point really as most of the players won't even be here next season - so it should be in his own self interest to prove to FV and us how good a coach he really is.

That's my view for what it is worth.

22Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Wed Feb 12 2020, 14:58

MartinBWFC

MartinBWFC
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
I don't see him getting sacked this season either Sluffy, but can see them pushing him out in May, FV know they can't remain a league 2 side financially, and I don't realistically see Hill getting better results in the bottom tier, I like Hill despite his inane ramblings, but we have to be realistic and say enough is enough and part company, as you say would be a waste of time doing it now though.

23Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Wed Feb 12 2020, 15:09

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
I won't comment on Sluffy's bullshit based on taking my words out of context and trying to restate what I meant other than saying that I do wonder how the FACT that Bunney is yet to play is somehow a reflection on Hill's ability to judge players. Perhaps he's implying that Hill should have foreseen the car crash that has kept him out?
Anyhow, at the beginning of the season I totally expected relegation by a country mile. After the first 6 games I thought it might be relegated by a humiliating margin as well, but was right behind the kids who were doing their best despite racking up a negative goal difference of epic proportions.
Since then, Hill and his cobbled together team have put up a bit of a fight to the extent we are not completely out of sight although we're obviously close to it.
And yet, the team aren't quite what is needed to pull off the miracle they say they still believe in but equally they are now not far off being that team inasmuch that previously we couldn't defend, create or score and now we can do 2 out of the 3 reasonably competently so there is at least something to work with.
I repeat, there is still a small chance that they will come good.

24Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Wed Feb 12 2020, 17:48

terenceanne

terenceanne
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf
Regarding the errors - Its called quality - better players make less mistakes, better passes etc.....when Silva or De Bruyne make a bad pass the crowd gasps.....the top teams can put 20 or more passes together in a row....lower leagues put three passes together at best then hoof it. 
Its not mistakes as such - just lack of quality. You can stand there all day shouting at a donkey and by the end of the day - its still a donkey.

25Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Thu Feb 13 2020, 00:46

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Regarding the errors - Its called quality - better players make less mistakes, better passes etc.....when Silva or De Bruyne make a bad pass the crowd gasps.....the top teams can put 20 or more passes together in a row....lower leagues put three passes together at best then hoof it. 
Its not mistakes as such - just lack of quality. You can stand there all day shouting at a donkey and by the end of the day - its still a donkey.
I have a theory about this.
Seems to me that Flitcroft and Hill have instilled a never say die/the world is against us (insert platitude of your choice here) attitude in the players which when you're up against it is generally considered a good thing as it tends to get maximum effort out of the players and they'll "put their bodies on the line" and throw themselves into blocking anything that comes their way however...
good defending requires much more than that, some of which is undoubtedly about quality and some of which is about organisation, calmness and teamwork which can be taught - even to donkeys - like "the Arsenal offside trap" in The Full Monty Smile
Most of the goals we've conceded recently have come down to one of two things...a total focus on the ball at the expense of watching and covering the movement of the opposing attacking players (which has led to 2 defenders going for the same ball and/or leaving attackers unmarked) and midfielders not tracking back to stay with runners properly. Several recent goals were conceded where the initial attack was blocked but the ball fell fortuitously to unmarked players who then scored. And last night Donny scored with a single pass slid through to a player who was left on his own 1 to 1 with Matthews (after our defenders crowded round the passer as if drawn by a magnet)
OK it was a good pass and a well taken finish but it could have been prevented.

I'm all for total commitment to defending the goal, but I think the players need to trust each other, keep an eye on what's happening around them (not just the ball) work as a unit and get better support from the midfield and if they can be taught how to use their brains as much as their bodies they might be on to something.

Much prefer losing by the odd goal than getting battered 5 nil every week but the obvious next step is to stop giving away daft goals and that can be worked on.

26Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Thu Feb 13 2020, 20:46

terenceanne

terenceanne
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Regarding the errors - Its called quality - better players make less mistakes, better passes etc.....when Silva or De Bruyne make a bad pass the crowd gasps.....the top teams can put 20 or more passes together in a row....lower leagues put three passes together at best then hoof it. 
Its not mistakes as such - just lack of quality. You can stand there all day shouting at a donkey and by the end of the day - its still a donkey.
I have a theory about this.
Seems to me that Flitcroft and Hill have instilled a never say die/the world is against us (insert platitude of your choice here) attitude in the players which when you're up against it is generally considered a good thing as it tends to get maximum effort out of the players and they'll "put their bodies on the line" and throw themselves into blocking anything that comes their way however...
good defending requires much more than that, some of which is undoubtedly about quality and some of which is about organisation, calmness and teamwork which can be taught - even to donkeys - like "the Arsenal offside trap" in The Full Monty Smile
Most of the goals we've conceded recently have come down to one of two things...a total focus on the ball at the expense of watching and covering the movement of the opposing attacking players (which has led to 2 defenders going for the same ball and/or leaving attackers unmarked) and midfielders not tracking back to stay with runners properly. Several recent goals were conceded where the initial attack was blocked but the ball fell fortuitously to unmarked players who then scored. And last night Donny scored with a single pass slid through to a player who was left on his own 1 to 1 with Matthews (after our defenders crowded round the passer as if drawn by a magnet)
OK it was a good pass and a well taken finish but it could have been prevented.

I'm all for total commitment to defending the goal, but I think the players need to trust each other, keep an eye on what's happening around them (not just the ball) work as a unit and get better support from the midfield and if they can be taught how to use their brains as much as their bodies they might be on to something.

Much prefer losing by the odd goal than getting battered 5 nil every week but the obvious next step is to stop giving away daft goals and that can be worked on.
Agreed - but the reason the defense is in trouble in the first place is that possession is given away up the field. Usually after a lump up the park. This causes the ball to come right back at us and therefore puts the defenders under pressure non stop. 
To state the bloody obvious...if we have the ball the other team can't score.

27Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Thu Feb 13 2020, 20:55

MartinBWFC

MartinBWFC
Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington
It's almost as if Parkinson never left.

28Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Fri Feb 14 2020, 11:35

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Good chance of me getting blown out of the West Stand tomorrow if storm Dennis turns up.

29Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Fri Feb 14 2020, 12:07

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Good chance of me getting blown out of the West Stand tomorrow if storm Dennis turns up.
 I wouldn't be surprised if it gets called off like City's game last week.

30Next 5 games Empty Re: Next 5 games on Fri Feb 14 2020, 12:20

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Good chance of me getting blown out of the West Stand tomorrow if storm Dennis turns up.
 I wouldn't be surprised if it gets called off like City's game last week.
Wouldn't surprise me either. Had a couple of people asking me to get them tickets, but I suggested I'd leave it until tomorrow morning and see how it looked.

Back to top  Message [Page 1 of 2]

Go to page : 1, 2  Next

Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum