Nepotism/Cronyism Watch

Norpig wrote:All above board? 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-56768601

Are we surprised?!

May not be illegal, but certainly doesn't pass the "smell test"..... again!

In the words of Ted Hastings from Line of Duty: "What have we become? Whatever happened to honesty and integrity?"

Norpig wrote:All above board? 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-56768601

Yes is the simple answer, all IS above board here.

As I've been saying, people are led to believe and WANT to believe that something wrong is going on but when you strip away the insinuations and slurs there is little if anything in it.

This is from the article itself -

'Acted entirely properly'

A Department of Health source said Mr Hancock had discussed the fact he was to be gifted shares in the firm with civil servants before he accepted them.

They ruled that if any conflicts of interest were to arise, they could be handled in line with the ministerial code, the rulebook setting out the standards of conduct for ministers.

The department also said the health secretary had no active role in running Topwood, and as health secretary for England, he had no responsibility for NHS Wales.

A government spokesperson said: "Mr Hancock has acted entirely properly in these circumstances. All declarations of interest have been made in accordance with the ministerial code. Ministers have no involvement in the awarding of these contracts, and no conflict of interest arises."

If you look at the original report on all this from an article from the Guido Fawkes blog it even says there is nothing in the story ffs!!!

"Matt Hancock is another big earner this month, registering a new gift of 15% of the issued share capital of Topwood Limited, his sister’s company apparently, under “a delegated management arrangement”. Given the current on-going cronyism debate and before everyone explodes, Guido would point out that while Topwood has been awarded two contracts with the NHS for waste destruction – worth £300,000 – they were awarded by NHS Wales, not NHS England for which he is responsible. Still, it seems a little reckless in the circumstances…"

https://order-order.com/2021/04/14/theresa-may-pockets-160370-from-jp-morgan-hancock-has-shares-in-nhs-contractor/

okocha wrote:
Are we surprised?!

May not be illegal, but certainly doesn't pass the "smell test"..... again!

In the words of Ted Hastings from Line of Duty: "What have we become? Whatever happened to honesty and integrity?"

The bit that made me laugh was the line "a government spokesman said there was no conflict of interest".

Well if the government say it's all above board it must be then

boltonbonce wrote:"As I've been saying, people are led to believe and WANT to believe that something wrong is going on but when you strip away the insinuations and slurs there is little if anything in it".


Might be worth posting that on 'Vince Watch', Sluffy. Just a thought.  

To be fair to Bob and the Vince thread we are talking about a difference in nuance between the two things here.

In terms of 'croynism' against the Tory government (and civil servants) in general a great deal is being made out that everything is 'dodgy' and quite truthfully it simply isn't - as per Hancock above, similarly with all this hoo-ha over Bill Crothers recently (question, can you or anyone else actually tell me what he's actually is being accused of doing wrong - although it's been in the papers and social media for the last few days - and before you say getting a job with Greensill whilst still a civil servant, then I refer you to him seeking permission to do so from the head of the civil service prior to doing so AND Greensill not even having a contract with the government at the time!).

However in respect of Vince there IS factual evidence that he's taken millions out of his company for his own 'vanity' projects such as FGR.

If he can pay the money back when it falls due, then he hasn't done anything wrong but if he can't....

...he most certainly has!

wanderlust wrote:

okocha wrote:
Are we surprised?!

May not be illegal, but certainly doesn't pass the "smell test"..... again!

In the words of Ted Hastings from Line of Duty: "What have we become? Whatever happened to honesty and integrity?"

The bit that made me laugh was the line "a government spokesman said there was no conflict of interest".

Well if the government say it's all above board it must be then

Well if you're so convinced there IS something dodgy about this then tell us all what it is.

How can anyone - let alone Hancock - who doesn't award contracts and dosen't even has any authority over NHS Wales who awarded the contract to the firm in question, influence the decision of the contract award???

I won't hold my breath for your explanation though - as per usual!!!

I know it's a crazy idea but what if Ministers and their families were not allowed to invest or be part of companies that come under their remit? Surely that would be sensible and stop these kind of incidents?

Norpig wrote:I know it's a crazy idea but what if Ministers and their families were not allowed to invest or be part of companies that come under their remit? Surely that would be sensible and stop these kind of incidents?

I would agree with that.

Norpig wrote:I know it's a crazy idea but what if Ministers and their families were not allowed to invest or be part of companies that come under their remit? Surely that would be sensible and stop these kind of incidents?

Well in a sort of way that is what happens now.

If anyone, never mind a Minister, is involved with anything in which they or their family have any 'interests' in (such as shares) they have to declare an interest and take no part in the decission making process, unless the interest is negligable.

That's what Hancock did.

The award of the contract to his sisters owned company was made by NHS Wales...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NHS_Wales

...which means it falls under the control of the Welsh Asembly - or in otherwords the Welsh government and NOT Parliament.

The award of the contract would have been done by welsh civil servants.

So Hancock is totally not involved at all - even though the papers, social media and Wanderlust obviously believe he was!

Dare I say it but it is once again people not understanding what actually happens in government (or business for that matter) and simply believe (want to believe even) anything that makes them look bad!

Even the originator of the story 'Guido Fawlks' basically states that there's nothing actually in the story itself "they were awarded by NHS Wales, not NHS England for which he is responsible. Still, it seems a little reckless in the circumstances…" yet the BMJ and BBC have picked up on the story and reported it as there WAS something dodgy because Hancock's name was mentioned.

Even the journalists (or at least some of them) don't understand what they are reporting - similarly (dare I say it again) as to how Iles stirred the pot over Anderson without any knowledge of the legalitities in keeping an insolvent company trading legally.

Some journalists (and others) however know exactly what the facts are yet still report them in such a way to discredit the government and/or its Ministers because it suits their political agendas to do so.

It's all a big game really and the general public are played because they don't know/understand what the facts are and simply happy (like Wanderlust clearly is) to believe anything bad about the Tory government (Ken Anderson previously) because that is what they want to believe anyway!

I'm not saying everything is done honestly but neither everything that has been reported on the Tory party and its Ministers that has now turned into a 'sleaze' campaign against the government has been corrupt/illegal,cronyism, or whatever else you want to class it as.

In fact I suggest the majority of it hasn't been sleaze, cronyism, nose in the trough at all!!!

That's why I stay out of politics - both sides are no different than each other.

There are only the two rules in politics - first gain power, second keep power - all this is about really is to sowing the seeds of distrust of the government in peoples minds so that they will vote Labour rather than Tory in the next General Election.

(It will be interesting how people will vote in next months local elections to see what if any effect so far all this has had on how people will be voting?)

okocha wrote:The PM announces a Greensill inquiry and the inquiry is headed by Nigel Boardman. 


He is a consultant of Slaughter and May. Slaughter and May lobbied against tightening lobbying laws.


It'll be as big a whitewash as the racism report

I've asked you countless times to post the link to your copy and paste's.

If not I'll simply remove all future ones as we have no idea who said it or in what context it was said.

Fair warning.

It was part of a private email sent to me. Fair answer?

You've asked me three times in total, but obviously I have no link that I can supply on this occasion.

Why do you need a source posted for something that’s common knowledge? Ridiculous reaction.

Norpig wrote:I know it's a crazy idea but what if Ministers and their families were not allowed to invest or be part of companies that come under their remit? Surely that would be sensible and stop these kind of incidents?

There are rules like this for NHS Trust directors. It doesn't stop it happening and it doesn't stop the cover-ups when it does.

Pretty obvious the rules aren’t fit for purpose, the 2014 lobbying act was a crock of shit then and the fears raised at the time have been proved correct.

okocha wrote:It was part of a private email sent to me. Fair answer?

You've asked me three times in total, but obviously I have no link that I can supply on this occasion.

I've asked you numerous times in the past as well as the recent two or three.

And what is the point in passing on gossip if you don't even know where it originates from or who said it?

If you got a private email sent you from QAnon would you post it on here as something you believe in???

Fair reply?

T.R.O.Y. wrote:Why do you need a source posted for something that’s common knowledge? Ridiculous reaction.

If it's such common knowledge then why don't you link to the source then so we can all see who said it and in what context.

I've worked in nuclear free local authorities (link below) but it doesn't mean I'm against nuclear power, I'm still plugged into the national grid for my electricity (so to are the authorities!) - my point being just because I worked there, did my job and represented the aims of the authority, it didn't mean I was personally committed to them all.

Boardman my well have worked at a law firm that lobbied against tightening lobbying laws but that doesn't mean the firm held that view themselves - I would have thought it was more likely that they had been employed by a client to undertake such work? - nor that Boardman personally was involved with this particular work/client - and even if he was that it was anything more than a job to him rather than some personal belief of his.

Now can you see why it is important to understand who is making these claims and in what context they are doing so?


https://www.nuclearpolicy.info/about/about-nfla/

Ten Bobsworth wrote:

Norpig wrote:I know it's a crazy idea but what if Ministers and their families were not allowed to invest or be part of companies that come under their remit? Surely that would be sensible and stop these kind of incidents?

There are rules like this for NHS Trust directors. It doesn't stop it happening and it doesn't stop the cover-ups when it does.

True Bob.

We don't live in a perfect world and some will always attempt to take more than they are entitled to - and some employers will cover-up the mess rather than face the consequences of public scandals.

There isn't a perfect way either to prevent abuses taking place, otherwise they would already be implemented everywhere.

Generally speaking the weakness in the system is usually human, someone not monitoring and checking as they probably should have been doing, or maybe being part of the scam themselves, or reporting what they found to someone who is.

Liverpool Council seems to be a case in point at the moment - an interesting read about it from yesterday if you haven't seen it -

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-56679807

It's about 'sleaze' by Labour politicians and the country's biggest Trade Union but it hardly got a mention in the headlines because 'sleaze' seems to only be done by the Tory party at the moment apparently - least I've not seen the likes of Maugham et al on social media calling for Judicial Reviews and allegations of cronyism!

I tell you - they are all as bad as each other whatever the colour is on their party rosettes!

Listen everybody, you lot might just see this business as the usual common or garden everyday Tory sleaze and cronyism, jobs for the boys, massive government contracts handed out to MP's friends, relatives, local pub landlords etc, greedy Tory MPs queuing up to get their noses in the trough.

Well you'd all be completely wrong. Sluffy says everything here is whiter than white and completely above board. That's more than enough for me!

Sluffy's ALWAYS RIGHT isn't he?

He bloody is, just ask him!!!