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Bolton Nuts » BWFC » Wandering Minds » Would you vote for the Green Party?

Would you vote for the Green Party?

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Norpig
Natasha Whittam
Whitesince63
BoltonTillIDie
Davesnuts
boltonbonce
Sluffy
wanderlust
12 posters

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21Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Thu Oct 07 2021, 15:22

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

Whitesince63 wrote:No, I wouldn’t vote for the greens, ever. For a start, although nobody can dispute global warming is happening, we can take a view on whether we’re causing it, or can do much if anything about it. Our planet is continually under the threat of climate change, we have always had hot periods, cold periods, floods and famines and the CO2 levels continually rise and fall. 

Having said all that, I don’t for one minute argue that we shouldn’t do what we can to help, especially regarding wildlife and the environment by controlling and reducing our dependence on plastics. The completely ridiculous wae against fossil fuels is just barmy. Sticking ugly, uneconomical windmills disrupting our countryside and seascapes is madness when we know very well that we can now produce increasingly efficient and low carbon petrol and diesel options.

Putting all our options into renewable electricity is crazy. What happens if the wind doesn’t blow, or the sun doesn’t shine and how many times are cables brought down when they do leaving regions stranded and when at least most could rely on staying warm with their gas heating. This rush into renewables without considering the many down sides and setting unrealistic timescales for implementation proves just how naive our politicians are.

The only winners from this will once again be the wealthy land owners who are raking it in with their Wind and Solar farms and they’re even prepared to rob a skinny, unaware little schoolgirl of her childhood to push their disgusting rhetoric.

I think the fact that even China where there are no wealthy landowners, is looking to move away from fossil fuels into renewable energy suggests a common worldwide acceptance that global warming this time around is very much human made and is/has already affected climate change to the detriment of the planet.

22Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Thu Oct 07 2021, 17:09

okocha

okocha
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf

I agree with you, Sluffy.

 I have voted for the Greens in the past, mainly due to their stance on the abomination that is nuclear weapons, and, in the absence of any other party being prepared to put morality and the welfare of humankind near the top of their agenda, I may well do so again when the time comes.

 It would be good to see more MPs than just Caroline Lucas wiping the floor with our inarticulate, bumbling liar of a PM in the HoC. It's time for common decency to be towards the top of UK priorities.

I'm sure the Green Party will continue to do well in the local elections and hope that more people will be prepared to stand by their instincts and convictions in a GE. I think the young might.

23Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Thu Oct 07 2021, 19:00

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Difficult for any small party to make progress without proportional representation.

24Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Thu Oct 07 2021, 23:08

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

The Earthshot series on BBC iPlayer is interesting. Sure it's the great and the good prognosticating but it outlines the 5 challenges to Earth's survival and showcases some cracking ideas that could change things - which as White alludes to may never happen as the superrich will protect their vested interest. And TBH not everyone is ready to be vegan.
Still worth a watch despite that though.

25Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Thu Oct 07 2021, 23:11

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Natasha Whittam wrote:

Sluffy could learn a lot from Dave. He made his point clearly in one word.
...and he actually had a point. Smile

26Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Oct 09 2021, 09:27

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

I think it’s somewhat a case of Newtons 3rd law here in that every action has an opposite and equal reaction. Surely nobody can doubt the science telling us the earth is warming. I’m even prepared to accept that we are impacting to some degree on that increase but by how much and what we can realistically do about it, I’m unsure.

For me though, if we are part of the problem, it’s the effect of population growth that is having the biggest effect. Cutting down trees to make space for food production and building the extra homes needed. Building those homes on known flood plains then wondering why they get flooded, building homes on known fire plains (California) then wondering why they get burned to a crisp. The more homes we have, the more homes we need to heat and provide water to and a complete failure to invest in better insulation of both new and existing homes to reduce energy consumption. 

Our problem is one of attempting to fight nature by increasingly ensuring people don’t die. We’ve just fast tracked a vaccine to prevent most Covid deaths, we’ve invented a new malaria vaccine to massively reduce the deaths from what is one of the biggest killers in Africa. All of these things are wonderful but sadly adding to the problem. Population growth is accelerating at an increasing pace but there are only so many people our planet can sustain and we are getting ever closer to reaching it. I don’t have an answer to it but I’d really like to hear our politicians discussing what is a known and unarguable fact, rather than one of our human effects on climate change which even experts disagree on.

27Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Oct 09 2021, 09:45

Guest


Guest

The vast majority of scientists are in agreement over this, (97% according to this article). Can you either give some evidence that backs your view it’s debatable or just give it a rest?

28Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Oct 09 2021, 10:20

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

I think you are being somewhat in denial 63 if you think science hasn't proven that global warming this time isn't man made, if you don't mind me saying so.

No doubt there are some random scientists that say differently, as there are some scientist who say we should not vaccinate against Covid but they are in the vast minority.

Denis Healy once said that if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging, so if we know our actions such as burning fossil fuels and chopping down rainforests are contributing to climate change then it would be a good idea if we could stop, or at least work towards stopping stuff like that.

As for how many people this planet can support, I don't know but if simply for your children and their children's children isn't it better to try and at least make the planet (and hence its climate) be as habitable as it can be until we reach that point - if we ever do?

I've no idea if nations will come together and deal with this in sufficient time, that video above shows that China isn't really bending over backwards to move as fast as it can to end using fossil fuels for instance.  

I certainly won't be around to see what's happening in 50 or 100 years from now but my daughter will be in 50 years and her children/grandchildren might/will be around in a 100 years, don't we owe it to them and everybody else's children/grandchildren to do the best we can now so they have the best future they can?

Sadly I can't see it happening - people are too selfish - Jesus look at how everyone went mad over getting fuel for their cars when there was always enough to go around and that a vast majority had no real need to go and fill their tanks up.  Multiply that attitude around the world and then think can we all make little sacrifices now to stop a big problem in the future?

Of course we can't!

Climate change is going to happen and it isn't going to end up good for those around when it starts to really get server.

But even saying that, better we do what we can now than stick our heads in the hole we have already dug, don't you think?

Well I do.

29Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Oct 09 2021, 10:26

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

boltonbonce wrote:Difficult for any small party to make progress without proportional representation.

Are you talking about Labour or the Green's?

:whistle:

30Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Oct 09 2021, 13:07

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Both.  Wink

31Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Nov 06 2021, 10:33

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

32Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Nov 06 2021, 15:00

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

Sluffy wrote:

I think the fact that even China where there are no wealthy landowners, is looking to move away from fossil fuels into renewable energy suggests a common worldwide acceptance that global warming this time around is very much human made and is/has already affected climate change to the detriment of the planet.


The Chinese haven’t given any commitments to going Green Sluffy, other than following an “aim” to be Carbon Neutral by 2070, yet couldn’t be arsed to turn up to COP26 to discuss it. Similarly India “aim” to be Carbon Neutral by 2060, whilst the Brazilians, Russians and Turkish also decline to give committed dates, whilst we in the UK and Europe hang ourselves with stupid, virtue signalling timescales we probably won’t even be able to achieve anyway but will bankrupt people and businesses in the process. If as you say, the Chineses and others are aware of the same scientific data and urgency as we are, how come they don’t seem as sure of the need to act on it now?

I fully accept climate change and I’m even prepared to accept that we should do what we can to reduce the problem but I don’t accept for one minute the timescales our politicians are quoting. Let’s do what we have always done and let the technology lead and follow it when we can afford to.



Last edited by Whitesince63 on Sat Nov 06 2021, 15:11; edited 1 time in total

33Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Nov 06 2021, 15:06

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

T.R.O.Y. wrote:The vast majority of scientists are in agreement over this, (97% according to this article). Can you either give some evidence that backs your view it’s debatable or just give it a rest?
List me the 100% of scientists you’re quoting then T.R.O.Y, then indicate the 97% agreeing and if you can’t then maybe you should give it a rest. You’ve been told 97% agree just like you were told most agreed on Covid but only because those who disagreed weren’t given a platform. It’s called brainwashing and propaganda.

34Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sat Nov 06 2021, 15:36

Guest


Guest

Did you click on the link? The research and references are already listed there.

The onus is on you to provide evidence that the science is a lie White - except you don’t have any, because you’re basing it on your own stupidity and ignoring the facts which disprove you.

35Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Sun Nov 07 2021, 08:13

Ten Bobsworth


El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf

How about a bit of Greta to brighten up a cold and wet Sunday.

36Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Mon Nov 08 2021, 14:43

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

I was just reading an article in "Conservative Home" that highlighted the widespread discontent with the government and Boris in particular and in the comments section someone cited a new Ipsos/Mori poll on voting intentions:

LAB: 36% (-)

CON: 35% (-4)

GRN: 11% ( 5)

LDEM: 9% (-)




The big winners appear to be the Green Party so it's clear some people - presumably laxed Tories - will be voting for them.




If you're interested the article is entitled "Johnson's plot to trash democracy and crown himself World King" Smile

37Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Fri Nov 12 2021, 12:13

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

So what do all you greenies think of COP26 then? Absolutely nothing achieved because the “science” you’ve been brainwashed into thinking we can do much about has been proved false. If it were so true and the warnings of Armageddon so convincing, do you seriously not think countries like China, India, Russia and others wouldn’t be just so minded to act on it? Which of these politicians will still be in office in 2060 and 2070, when their “aim” to reach carbon neutral is reached? Not one, because they know the planet will still be here and so will life as we know it. 

Nobody doubts climate change, or thinks it’s not pertinent to look for renewable energy options because ultimately fossil fuels will run out and they’ll have to, but all this bollocks spouted by virtue signalling western democracies that the worlds about to end is just wrong. We’re filling our kids heads with fear and nonsense instead of concentrating their minds on how we change things in the future as technology drives it and it is a government failure. We all thought we knew everything as teenagers but it’s only as we get older that we realise we knew nothing. Thank goodness we had the older generations to temper us but now we’re supposed to listen to some brainwashed 18 year old Swedish child on how to save the planet. It’s ridiculous and we should be ashamed of ourselves for falling for it.

38Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Fri Nov 12 2021, 12:19

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Uncanny resemblance to a Daily Fail editorial that 63  Shocked

Oh and all utter bollocks of course.

39Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Fri Nov 12 2021, 12:51

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Whitesince63 wrote:So what do all you greenies think of COP26 then? Absolutely nothing achieved
-small vague commitments to "aim for" a fifth of the  methane and carbon reductions required - so broadly I agree
because the “science” you’ve been brainwashed into thinking we can do much about has been proved false
- no it hasn't

If it were so true and the warnings of Armageddon so convincing, do you seriously not think countries like China, India, Russia and others wouldn’t be just so minded to act on it?
- no I don't. The West was built on the exploitation of cheap fossil fuels and that gave us the huge advantage and relative wealth that we enjoy today so developing countries are very resistant to being told that they can't do the same thing - especially as they're sitting on huge fossil fuel resources. They are balancing their concerns for global warming against their desire to catch up with and overtake the West economically.

Which of these politicians will still be in office in 2060 and 2070, when their “aim” to reach carbon neutral is reached?
- nobody wants Boris around next year, let alone in 50 years' time
Not one, because they know the planet will still be here and so will life as we know it. 
- there is no evidence whatsoever to suggest they believe that - but plenty to suggest the opposite

Nobody doubts climate change, or thinks it’s not pertinent to look for renewable energy options because ultimately fossil fuels will run out and they’ll have to, but all this bollocks spouted by virtue signalling western democracies that the worlds about to end is just wrong. We’re filling our kids heads with fear and nonsense instead of concentrating their minds on how we change things in the future as technology drives it and it is a government failure. We all thought we knew everything as teenagers but it’s only as we get older that we realise we knew nothing. Thank goodness we had the older generations to temper us but now we’re supposed to listen to some brainwashed 18 year old Swedish child on how to save the planet. It’s ridiculous and we should be ashamed of ourselves for falling for it.

-When I was young we lived in constant fear of nuclear holocaust. We were made to sit up to watch the Cuban Missile Crisis. My mum wouldn't breastfeed my little brother because of Strontium 90. We all thought the world could end at any minute throughout the Cold War.
But because my generation was aware of the danger, the world and politics changed and although we could still all get nuked at any time, the risk has dissipated a bit.

So if the world is going to hell on a handcart your plan would be to not mention it?

40Would you vote for the Green Party? - Page 2 Empty Re: Would you vote for the Green Party? Fri Nov 12 2021, 13:21

Guest


Guest

Are we just supposed to take your word from it that the science is false White?

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