The case for 442 - for now...

We have no width. Our strikers are getting no quality service and our back 4 is getting slaughtered by attacks down both flanks as a result.
The opposition is able to control the game in the middle as we are so narrow and they always have an easy out when we do manage to put them under pressure.
Lee and Ngog are both working across the front just behind the strikers going from side to side, but are being asked to do too much as Spearing and Medo are cruising, locked into a defensive role.
90% of the through balls to the strikers are predictable forward passes from the midfield and only 20% of those are decent quality - and in the prolonged absence of Holden and Mavies I can't see how that quality of through ball will improve in the near future.

I hate to say it, but having watched the games so far, I think there's a genuine case for 442 this season. Or 4141 or similar variation - either way we need 4 across the midfield to push back the opposition.

Second point:
Have we the players available to do it? I'd say maybe.
My concern is that in order for 442 or similar to work well, we need FBs that link up with wingers in getting up and down the flanks. Not sure if our FBs are mobile enough and not sure if White (who is highly mobile) is ready.

You know it, I know it, the rest of the forum knows it, so it looks like we have another brainless Scot in charge and before anyone says it yes I have backed him throughout but now it's beyond a joke, for me he can go now because he aint learning.

the trouble with 442 is that our wingers aren't good at tracking back and helping out the full backs when needed and if we play Spearing and Medo in the centre there are not creative enough. But we have little other option at the moment.

The lack of genuine width has been very evident so far this season but we just don't have enough quality to play 442 at the moment i think. Maybe its time to try a 352? Dougie has mentioned that before and we can't get any worse surely?

You make a decent point Wander but we got slaughtered playing 442 under coyle, we're getting battered playing a 451 type system under dougie so maybe we need to try another formation that might actually work.

You mention pushing the opposition back so how about 4-3-3, with Ngog, Beckford and Davies up front with Medo Spearing and Pratley in midfied?.....That still may not work but surely we would create more attempts on goal than we are now, plus it would give the other team something to think about if they saw us lining up with 3 strikers from the off.

I've said this all along. No formation/tactics are perfect because we have a poor squad - but our best chance is to play two out-and-out wingers in Eagles & Hall and try and take the game to the opposition for a change.

And with two strikers in the penalty area we are increasing our chances of actually getting a few shots in.

But this is too simple for Freedman, and way too attacking. And that's why he has to go. You don't get promoted being cautious.

Having got rid of Petrov, I don't think wingers tracking back will be as much of a problem. Lee is currently being asked to work his socks off running side to side across the pitch behind the forwards - ask him to play as a winger and work up and down the pitch and it shouldn't be a problem. Eagles may struggle defensively and Hall I'm not sure about yet in that respect.
Since Alonso got his act together we haven't had proper attacking FBs although Baptiste showed he can do it yesterday. And we have Hayden White waiting patiently for a chance - don't know if he's anywhere near ready but that lad can shift. Even Mears could do a decent job up and down the park and I haven't forgotten Riley. So it's do-able.

Playing 4 across the middle, I'd drop Medo for now until he gets his workrate up and play Ream or even give Josh Vela another shot.

That would give us more options at the back as there'd be better protection. Then I'd like to put 2 bullies who aren't afraid to shoot up front: something like this:

White or Mears Knight Mills Baptiste
Lee or Eagles Spearing Ream Hall
       Eaves Cavies

Pace, power and a bit of craft - I like it!

It's time to ditch Lee, he simply doesn't offer much anymore.

He's not particularly quick, doesn't take players on like he used to, and his final ball is, well, shocking.

Eagles and Hall would give us a bit of pace and a lot of threat.

Natasha Whittam wrote:It's time to ditch Lee, he simply doesn't offer much anymore.

He's not particularly quick, doesn't take players on like he used to, and his final ball is, well, shocking.

Eagles and Hall would give us a bit of pace and a lot of threat.

What do you think of the other proposed changes?
Do you like the look of that team and system for this league?

Natasha Whittam wrote:It's time to ditch Lee, he simply doesn't offer much anymore.

He's not particularly quick, doesn't take players on like he used to, and his final ball is, well, shocking.

Eagles and Hall would give us a bit of pace and a lot of threat.

Did you watch the game yesterday? Lee had another good game, he's looking more like his old self than he has in a while and was probably our best creative player.

Think he's benefitting from playing a free role, getting more space and clearly has a bit more confidence. The problem is (as lust points out), we're not playing with enough width which hinders us going forward and defensively. The space Blackburns wingers had to run into yesterday was incredible and Knight and Wheater were absolutely appalling too. 

For both of Rhodes's goals Knight failed to pick up the one danger man in the box, he did absolutely nothing to stop them. One or both of Knight and Wheater need to be replaced, Dougie must feel the same after yesterday.

wanderlust wrote:Playing 4 across the middle, I'd drop Medo for now until he gets his workrate up and play Ream or even give Josh Vela another shot.

That would give us more options at the back as there'd be better protection. Then I'd like to put 2 bullies who aren't afraid to shoot up front: something like this:

White or Mears Knight Mills Baptiste
Lee or Eagles Spearing Ream Hall
       Eaves Cavies

Pace, power and a bit of craft - I like it!

I'd only play one of Eaves and Cavies, the most important thing is trying to get a settled front line. That may mean persisting with N'gog and Beckford to be fair, but getting a decent partnership going will be key.

Talking of partnerships I want to see Wheater and Ream given a go at CB, it worked okay in the premier league and it's worth another go we can't possibly do worse than we are at the moment.

Definitely want to see White, Mears didn't look quick enough to keep up with their winger yesterday, at least White should be able to do that.

We haven't had a settled front pairing since Adam was a lad, but it isn't the most important thing IMHO as without quality service and decent chances it's irrelevant.
I just think that given our position there's no harm in trying to f*** up the opposition by giving them a physical battle to contend with in their own box which we have failed to do so far this season - and if we have width and no easy ball out I'm for picking strikers that shoot on sight i.e. Eaves and Cavies.

bwfc1874 wrote:
Definitely want to see White, Mears didn't look quick enough to keep up with their winger yesterday, at least White should be able to do that.

I agree. But like Coyle before him, Freedman prefers to pick tried and not trusted shite like Mears rather than risk a youngster actually being a decent player.

The problem for Dougie in respect to the youngsters is the fans will not accept a season of consolidation where we give youngsters a chance to grow, and the teething pains that go along with it.

Hipster_Nebula wrote:The problem for Dougie in respect to the youngsters is the fans will not accept a season of consolidation where we give youngsters a chance to grow, and the teething pains that go along with it.

Exactly, I'd like to see him play the kids. But I've no idea how good they are at the moment, if he put them in and they had a poor game they'd probably get booed by certain "fans" and have their confidence shattered.

It's like Nat branding Vela as complete shit because her dad said he didn't have the best game away at Leicester last season. Our fans have no patience even if he did try.

Lee at his best would struggle with the role he's often had under Dougie. He was a top player in 10/11 when he just had the right hand side to worry about. He's not cut out for the left, and he's definitely not cut out for a bit of both.

I also don't agree with Pratley in his role in front of Medo and Spearing, or indeed any role. He's still not good enough, unfortunately. A second wide player would have been a better option yesterday.

So, I agree that 4-4-2 is currently the best suited formation for us.