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BWFC - Creditors Voluntary Liquidation

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Sluffy
Ten Bobsworth
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wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Sluffy wrote:
wanderlust wrote:
Natasha Whittam wrote:
Sluffy wrote:Do I think so - Yes.


Do you accept that an employer/owner has a responsibility to his or her staff?
You're spoiling the love-in.
Although a better question might be "do you think that Bolton Wanderers was better off when Anderson left than when he first wrested control and insisted on taking total responsibility for the club?"

No doubt the response will be a resounding yay.

What a daft question.

Let me answer it by asking you this question -

"do you think that Bolton Wanderers was better off when Eddie Davies left than when he first wrested control and insisted on taking total responsibility for the club?"

I'll even give you a clue,  the club was about £20m in debt when he took control and £200m in debt when he left.

So did Eddie rape and pillage the club like you believe Ken Anderson did, or do you not realise the clubs been insolvent for years and only kept going by Davies continuing to fund it from his back pocket - and when he died and no one else wanted to throw away their money into a big black hole, the inevitable happened.

It's not exactly difficult to understand what actually occurred and why, if they set their mind to it rather than believe what they read on twitter and Facebook by people who clear didn't know their arse from their elbow!

Fwiw the club continues to be insolvent and part of the EFL's fit and proper test was for FV to show proof that they could cover the losses of the club for the next two years.

So another question for you,

"do you think that Bolton Wanderers will be better off in two years time (knowing that FV has budgeted for a trading deficit for both those years) than it is now following from Sharron's ownership of it?"

In fact I'll even give you the answer -

No, in financial terms it won't be, as the club debt will have increased, with Sharron (most likely anyway) being the creditor to whom the money put in to keep it trading, becoming the creditor (and probably secured against the clubs assets).

Will she have raped and pillage the club over those two years too?
During Eddie Davies' tenure, the club enjoyed the most successful and entertaining period since the 1950's or even the 1920's - at his personal expense.
Debt was accrued by the management team (Gartside) that he trusted to make the decisions and manage the finances on his behalf and yet despite that the club was left with assets that outstripped the debts i.e. solvent.

During Anderson's tenure we went from bad to worse to broke. Debt was accrued by the man who took all the decisions - Ken Anderson.

There is no valid comparison.

Ten Bobsworth


Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington

The full document is now available on the Companies House website.

One of the most unsatisfactory parts of the admin process imo was the failure of the administrators to reconcile their statement regarding the amounts owed to Ken Anderson with the amount KA maintained he was owed.

It was a failure that virtually guaranteed a lengthy and bitter dispute until it was eventually accepted that KA was owed the £7.5m he had borrrowed from Eddie Davies to keep the club afloat and consequently owed to the the Fildraw Trust.

The delay had a major adverse impact on the club's prospects for the current season and I expect also that KA and FV will have incurred significant additional costs as a result. Neither would I be surprised if KA had given some assurance to Paul Aldridge that he would not be left high and dry when it was all settled.

Our old friend Dean Vince still hasn't filed the Ecotricity Group accounts. At best they are going to be last minute. I wonder why.

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

wanderlust wrote:
Sluffy wrote:
wanderlust wrote:
Natasha Whittam wrote:
Sluffy wrote:Do I think so - Yes.


Do you accept that an employer/owner has a responsibility to his or her staff?
You're spoiling the love-in.
Although a better question might be "do you think that Bolton Wanderers was better off when Anderson left than when he first wrested control and insisted on taking total responsibility for the club?"

No doubt the response will be a resounding yay.

What a daft question.

Let me answer it by asking you this question -

"do you think that Bolton Wanderers was better off when Eddie Davies left than when he first wrested control and insisted on taking total responsibility for the club?"

I'll even give you a clue,  the club was about £20m in debt when he took control and £200m in debt when he left.

So did Eddie rape and pillage the club like you believe Ken Anderson did, or do you not realise the clubs been insolvent for years and only kept going by Davies continuing to fund it from his back pocket - and when he died and no one else wanted to throw away their money into a big black hole, the inevitable happened.

It's not exactly difficult to understand what actually occurred and why, if they set their mind to it rather than believe what they read on twitter and Facebook by people who clear didn't know their arse from their elbow!

Fwiw the club continues to be insolvent and part of the EFL's fit and proper test was for FV to show proof that they could cover the losses of the club for the next two years.

So another question for you,

"do you think that Bolton Wanderers will be better off in two years time (knowing that FV has budgeted for a trading deficit for both those years) than it is now following from Sharron's ownership of it?"

In fact I'll even give you the answer -

No, in financial terms it won't be, as the club debt will have increased, with Sharron (most likely anyway) being the creditor to whom the money put in to keep it trading, becoming the creditor (and probably secured against the clubs assets).

Will she have raped and pillage the club over those two years too?
During Eddie Davies' tenure, the club enjoyed the most successful and entertaining period since the 1950's or even the 1920's - at his personal expense.
Debt was accrued by the management team (Gartside) that he trusted to make the decisions and manage the finances on his behalf and yet despite that the club was left with assets that outstripped the debts i.e. solvent.

During Anderson's tenure we went from bad to worse to broke. Debt was accrued by the man who took all the decisions - Ken Anderson.

There is no valid comparison.

Yet again someone not grasping reality that the 'owner' and the 'company' are two separate legal entities.

BWFC ran at a massive loss under Eddie's ownership and was only kept going by him not taking out of the club the £200m that was owed to him as a 'creditor'.

Let us kill the myth you keep perpetuating about the clubs assets outstripping the debts - they didn't - and that is why Davies £200m he wrote off were 'unsecured' - there simply wasn't any other assets the club owned that had not already had other creditors loans 'secured' against them!!!

When Anderson took on the club James already was the head creditor against the hotel, Warburton against the land and Eddie against the club.  Holdsworth's BM loan was secured against the rest.

That meant that the club had to depend on its turnover to remain trading and solvent.

The simple truth is that the clubs running expenses are greater than its revenue (they still are) and unlike Eddie before him and Sharon after him, KA simply didn't wish to fund the sustainability of the club from his own pocket knowing he was unlikely to ever get it back - and why should he?

The club eventually ran out of money to pay the bills - just like any other insolvent business.

You can bluster all you like but you can't get away from the simple facts.

Ten Bobsworth


Frank Worthington
Frank Worthington

I'm afraid Sluffy that Wanderlust's understanding of finance and ability to read a balance sheet is roughly equivalent to my knowledge of nuclear science. i.e. negligible.
But he's far from alone.

Just out of curiosity, I checked out Nottingham Forest this morning and noted that it was incorporated as a company limited by shares in 1982 (Brian Clough era). Prior to that I assume it might have been run as some sort of supporters co-operative just like the Forest supporter told me in 1959 when we played them in 6th round of the FA Cup. I was fourteen at the time but for some reason the conversation stuck in my mind.

Anyone knows any different I'd be interested to know.

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