Do these look like women to you?

These are the two 'lady' boxers who won gold at the Olympics but are barred from their governing body the world IBA International Boxing Association for being 'partly' men!

The following article explains the 'grey area' between being a man or a woman.

In simple terms these two women - are biologically women (they have the lady bits) BUT were meant by nature to be born men.

It seems they have testicles within their bodies that have given them testosterone and the strength and physicality of men. They also lack the internal women organs to have babies.

It seems there is a man 'trigger' as we develop in the womb that determines from that point on if we are born a boy or a girl (it also means us boys get our willies!). If the trigger doesn't go off properly, then that becomes the grey area.

Bit of a tricky one for all concerned but to my way of thinking the two 'ladies' above benefitted from the male testosterone testicles within them that led to their power and the strength that women without that unintended course of nature were born not to have.

I'm a father to a daughter and if one of these boxers had been my child I would be wanting her to be inclusive in all women's sports and life in general - but if my real daughter had to compete against them I would be among those protesting that was completely unfair.

The article is here and is a good read imo.

What does science tell us about boxing’s gender row?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crlr8gp813ko

I’ve been saying this for ages that there should be 3 gender categories in that respect.

Men’s
Women’s
Transgender

Put all the males who want to be females in the transgender category and put all the females who want to be males in it. That way it’s up to them and it will stop birth males (if you will) from battering bloody women!

Men and women can get on with actual competing with one another then. Simples!

I agree, well sort of.

These two aren't actually transsexuals, they were born female, BUT...

The but is that nature intended them to be born MALE and something went wrong and the 'switch' that sends a baby's body down the path to becoming a boy, didn't properly activate, resulting in a sort of half and half person (no insult intended) - having the body and most of the organs of a woman but with the testicles of a man trapped inside of them - pumping out testosterone - giving them the strength and the power of a male that women who nature intended to be women, simply don't have.

It all sort of start with Caster Semenya, remember him her...



The 2018 rules meant that Semenya could not compete in female track events over this distance without taking testosterone-reducing drugs.

She appealed against World Athletics' proposal at the Switzerland-based Court of Arbitration for Sport (Cas), but eventually lost in what amounted to a landmark case in 2019.

It was in the Cas ruling that Semenya's specific DSD was confirmed as 46 XY 5-ARD (5-alpha-reductase deficiency). People with this particular DSD have the male XY chromosomes. Some are assigned female or male at birth depending on their external genitalia.

Semenya told BBC Sport that she was "born without a uterus" and born "with internal testicles" and said: "I am a woman and have a vagina".

Cas said, external athletes like Semenya with 5-ARD have "circulating testosterone at the level of the male 46 XY population and not at the level of the female 46 XX population", which gives them "a significant sporting advantage over 46 XX female athletes".

While the Swiss Federal Supreme Court temporarily suspended the Cas ruling, it later reversed its decision - paving the way for World Athletics' new rules to come into effect.

"Biology has to trump gender identity," athletics' governing body said in a statement welcoming the decision.

Switzerland's top court rejected another appeal by Semenya in September 2020, after her team again sought to challenge the Cas ruling.

The story carries on further and anyone interested can read the full article here -
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/athletics/67367157

Carrying this on in a more recent article...

It has been especially relevant to athletics, in which South African middle distance runner Caster Semenya - who was born with DSD condition 46 XY 5-ARD - twice won Olympic 800m gold. At Rio 2016, all three medallists in the women's 800m were DSD athletes, including the winner Semenya.

So to put it crudely - intentionally for effect - three 'blokes' won gold, silver and bronze at the Olympics Women's 800m in Rio!!!

The article gives statistics to underline the point -

World Athletics has claimed that while "approximately 1 in 20,000 of the general population have a 46 XY DSD, in elite women's competition, the proportion is approximately 7 in 1,000 - a prevalence that is 140 times higher". It argued that "this is strong evidence of a performance advantage".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/articles/c0l8gxzw6n4o


I've deliberately oversimplified and been overly blunt to highlight the issue - if I've offended anyone I apologise - it was not my intention to do so.

The bottom line for me though is that through no fault of their own these people have an advantage over women who were intended to be born as women and not men.

And that can't be fair or proper.

So yes, for me, men's events, women's events and a third category for others.

We don't enter disabled athletes to compete with able bodied athletes - what's the point, they won't win if they did, so surely we can't allow 'women' through no fault of their own who have male attributes which give them an unfair advantage to women born without the male attributes - what's the point they won't win against them like no 'woman' was able to get a medal in the Women's 800m in Rio!

Received an email notification linking to this bollocks & thought "Go on...I'll have a look because it's obviously that weird cunt Sluffy being a mentalist again" so I clicked on it & here we are...

Fuck me, you're a strange man.

Get a hobby, for fuck's sake.

Breadman wrote:Received an email notification linking to this bollocks & thought "Go on...I'll have a look because it's obviously that weird cunt Sluffy being a mentalist again" so I clicked on it & here we are...

Fuck me, you're a strange man.

Get a hobby, for fuck's sake.

Perhaps Sluffy posted it to simply try and provoke debate…

karlypants wrote:

Perhaps Sluffy posted it to simply try and provoke debate…

No, he did it because he's a weird cunt.

And you just run round behind him licking his arse & lobbing your own retarded thoughts in.

You've both been doing this exact same sad shit for an audience of about 6 people for at least 15 years that I know of.

FFS...big wide world out there, lads.

Breadman wrote:

karlypants wrote:

Perhaps Sluffy posted it to simply try and provoke debate…

No, he did it because he's a weird cunt.

And you just run round behind him licking his arse & lobbing your own retarded thoughts in.

You've both been doing this exact same sad shit for an audience of about 6 people for at least 15 years that I know of.

FFS...big wide world out there, lads.

Just remember who came back to read this guff then David. You did!

Go easy on them beers!

Nice to see you back Breaders even if it was brief and brutal. I'm still one of the 6 with no life 

Fwiw, I've not seen the original deleted post, nor banned him.

I started this thread simply to spark some sort of discussion - it was after all the MOST controversial issue of the whole Paris Olympics ffs!!!

Breadman clearly has a major issue with me - he pops up randomly overs the years to hurl abuse at me - all stemming from me refusing to permanently ban from here the 'Scotty' account, which he so badly wanted me to do.

I'm pretty sure that the Scott account was one of Natasha's fake ones - although I couldn't prove it to be so.

Anyway how anyone could get so wound up and angry enough to want to troll me and carry on trolling me for something like ten years now, over something and nothing on a meaningless, obscure, football forum, as Nuts has always been, should, I suggest, tell people more about  Breadman than me or anyone else.

It simply isn't normal behaviour - is it?

I've chosen in the past not to respond to him - don't feed the troll so to speak - because that's where trolls get their pleasure from - getting inside your head, making you react to them - so they can troll you more and more.

Breadman means absolutely nothing to me, he can howl at the moon as much as he wants - call me all the names under the Sun if he likes - it doesn't effect me.

I wouldn't have banned him personally, he simply joins Nuts again under a different user name, and carries on where he left off - (although the ban might well have been abuse aimed at someone else other than at me - and worthy of an outright ban in itself)

Seems much easier to have all his insults under the one user name, to me.

Anyway what is done is done.

Back on topic, if anyone is bothered(?), The Telegraph did a good article on 'ideology' over 'common sense'.

Blinded by ideology: Inside boxing row that undermined IOC and tarnished Olympics

President Bach has failed in his duty to protect female athletes by allowing Khelif and Lin to win gold despite failing sex tests

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/olympics/2024/08/11/ioc-boxing-gender-olympic-games-imane-khelif/

Some more recent news along the same lines...

Australian court rules in landmark case that asked 'what is a woman?'

Basically a woman, Sall Grover...



...set up an app called 'Giggle for Girls' as a 'safe place for women'.

Transsexual Roxanne Tickle...



...joined and then was banned later for 'being male'.

Tickle sued.

The best thing about the story is the case was called Tickle v Giggle.

As someone who identifies as a woman, Tickle claimed she was legally entitled to use services meant for women, and that she was discriminated against based on her gender identity.

She sued the social media platform, as well as its CEO Sall Grover, and sought damages amounting to A$200,000, claiming that “persistent misgendering” by Grover had prompted “constant anxiety and occasional suicidal thoughts”.

Giggle’s legal team argued throughout the case that sex is a biological concept.

They freely concede that Tickle was discriminated against - but on the grounds of sex, rather than gender identity. Refusing to allow Tickle to use the app constituted lawful sex discrimination, they say. The app is designed to exclude men, and because its founder perceives Tickle to be male - she argues that denying her access to the app was lawful.


This was what Sall Grover said before the court case...

“I’m being taken to federal court by a man who claims to be a woman because he wants to use a woman-only space I created,” she posted on X.

“There isn’t a woman in the world who’d have to take me to court to use this woman only space. It takes a man for this case to exist.”

She says she created her app “Giggle for Girls” in 2020 after receiving a lot of social media abuse by men while she worked in Hollywood as a screenwriter.

“I wanted to create a safe, women-only space in the palm of your hand,” she said.

“It is a legal fiction that Tickle is a woman. His birth certificate has been altered from male to female, but he is a biological man, and always will be.”

“We are taking a stand for the safety of all women’s only spaces, but also for basic reality and truth, which the law should reflect.”

However the judge ruled against her...

Justice Robert Bromwich said in his decision on Friday that case law has consistently found sex is “changeable and not necessarily binary”, ultimately dismissing Giggle’s argument.

The Federal Court found that although Roxanne Tickle had not been directly discriminated against, she was a victim of indirect discrimination - which refers to when a decision disadvantages a person with a particular attribute - and ordered the app to pay her A$10,000 ($6,700; £5,100) plus costs.

Full story here -
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c07ev1v7r4po

This sort of shit just fuels the right wing hatred.

It's just plain stupid to me.

If boys want to be girls or girls want to be boys, then let them.

If girls don't want to have sex changed boys on their app, then leave them be, there most be hundreds of other apps that girls will let them join.

Christ I'm banned from a number of footy forums, I wouldn't dream of taking anybody to court over it, I'd simply think if they don't want me on there it is their loss not mine.

The problem to me is not inclusivity, the problem is 'forcing' the issue on people such as the Giggle for girls app and then 'politicising' it.

There most be hundreds and thousands of transsexuals on women only apps who find no problems so why did Tickle make such a song and dance about joining the one app that didn't want him???

The worlds gone mad.

This 'wokism' really needs to be binned and people stop being so extremist all the time.

We should work together and not against each other all the time.

I'm a, and i quote from facebook, a "loony lefty" and even i think this is all ridiculous.

I don’t like the phrase right wing, left wing or central etc.

At one time I would have been considered right wing but it’s not the case. I simply vote for who I feel is a good replacement as in new government as the current government is not going in the right direction I feel.

I also know what is right and wrong and stick by it. A lot of it is simply black and white to me.

I think it is a form of discrimination or almost like a racism kind of thing where people from the left and right use this name to tarnish someone that doesn’t hold the same views as theirs.

At the end of the day with people such as Tommy Robinson and the riots we have had lately are simply thugs or rascist pigs and shouldn’t be labelled as right wing as this isn’t the case.

Have to disagree there KP, Tommy ten names is a racist and incited his followers which is what caused the riots. He is definitely far right as is Clacton's missing MP Nigel Farage.

Norpig wrote:Have to disagree there KP, Tommy ten names is a racist and incited his followers which is what caused the riots. He is definitely far right as is Clacton's missing MP Nigel Farage.

They are rascist thugs and pigs we agree but i feel that labelling them right wing is incorrect imo.

Simply Call it what it is.

It’s the same with you labelling yourself a loony left.

You are just a fruit and nut mate.

karlypants wrote:It’s the same with you labelling yourself a loony left.

You are just a fruit and nut mate.

I do consider myself a lefty but people who i've had disagreements with on FB called me it and a clown as well. Suffice to say we are no longer friends on FB.

I'm still friends with you though KP 

Norpig wrote:

karlypants wrote:It’s the same with you labelling yourself a loony left.

You are just a fruit and nut mate.

I do consider myself a lefty but people who i've had disagreements with on FB called me it and a clown as well. Suffice to say we are no longer friends on FB.

I'm still friends with you though KP 

Me too mate

To be fair, I don't think of you as some loony left at all. I think of you as a person that doesn't agree with certain things that's all.

Politics, and to some extent values, are shown, explained, measured, viewed or call it what you will, as a spectrum.

For instance 'light', or at least the bit we can see with our eyes, is not 'white' it is made up of colours ranging from red on one side and violet at the other end of the spectrum with orange, green, yellow, etc, in between.

So to measure yours and everybody else's views, politics opinions and so on, in order to understand where they fit in on the 'political' spectrum it has become easier to put people in to general groupings.

If you have say Mother Teresa at one end of the scale and say Attila the Hun or Adolf Hitler at the other, then most people would slot in somewhere in between them.

In the past the scale was shown as a horseshoe (because the theory went that if you went too far one way, the common consensus would move against it to bring it back to be somewhere nearer the middle again - a pendulum effect.

Unfortunately the world of fake news and social media has created a polarisation towards the two extremes - look at W63 for instance - thoroughly nice chap I don't doubt but he has his head filled with right wing radical ideology - and he doesn't even know it.  In fact he thinks I'M the one who has been radicalised!!!

Nobody has the perfect idea of politics, values, living together - or if they did we'd all be doing it by now.

At its simplest at the moment it is about autocracy v democracy.

God help us all if W63 and his mates votes for autocracy and wins.

Transgender's and taking the knee would be the least of our worries.