Big U-Turn on Pasty Tax!

Can't believe this!!!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-18179735


What i can't believe is the introduction in the First place.

your a few weeks late on this one

Anyway, when a country is in massive debt tax increases have to occur, its the same for every economy.

Most other hot food is already taxed, but yeh I can see why this could be seen as a bit silly, but its also understandable.

You can explain or bat off any conceivable tax increase with that line about the national debt, Lofty, but the problem with the pasty tax is the demographic it will affect most.

Just like cutting the top rate of tax, it is indefensible. And I've voted Conservative at every election.

When a country is in Debt... First of all , a Question to the Learned people on here.

Have we ever been Debt Free.
As a individual. i'm Debt free, always been cautious, never stretched myself by wanting things i cant afford.
But i'm also aware there are people, who in the the past who have Borrowed Heavily on their property and when the Crash came, they were Fucked.

Now we are paying for their mistakes... that's my view anyway.

When America sneezes, the UK catches a cold.

This recession has its roots in the sub-prime lending crisis in the US. Firstly, lenders were allowing borrowers with average to poor credit histories to borrow too much against their properties. Who is to blame? The lender or the borrower? An interesting question and the answer is both, but there has to be an acceptance that irresponsible lending is a product of a self-regulated industry driven by corporate avarice and a results and bonuses culture.

The major reason this impacted the UK economy so sharply is because among other practices, the bankers in the City were trading and investing in 'packages' of these US sub-prime loans. So when the sub-prime lending chickens came home to roost in the Land of the Free, it hit our economy hard. This has had a domino effect on all aspects of economic activity.

We have never been debt free. All developed countries have a national debt. The issue, for me, is that Labour failed to fix the roof while the sun was shining and the country was in no position to cope with the economic crisis. We had the highest deficit in proportion to our GDP (the value of all goods and services in the economy) of any European nation.

So you're right in saying we're paying for the mistakes of private individuals who have borrowed beyond their means, but we're also paying for the mistakes of lenders who played fast and loose and took undue levels of risk in pursuit of profits, a Labour government which raised tax to record levels but over-invested in the public sector instead of working to reduce the deficit, all borne out of a crisis which began across the pond.

As a footnote, the single biggest gaffe Labour made was when Gordon Brown sold our 400 tonne gold reserves for £2.3 billion. That gold today is worth around £12 billion. It is sickening to think how many jobs this has cost.

It just goes to show that tangible assets should as commodities and property have been disregarded in the modern age in favour of stocks, shares and bonds and numbers on screens.

Largehat I agree with most of your analysis but I think you miss two crucial elements.

Gordon Brown's belief in a "light touch regulation" of the City allowed the banks to get even greedier and take even bigger risks e.g Fred Goodwin, Northern Rock, etc.

And what about Thatcher and her encouragement of the cult of greed and selfishness?

The New Few, a book written by one of Thatcher's advisers, Ferdinand Mount, gives a fascinating account of how we got to where we are now, with the rich getting ever richer (and paying little or no taxes) whilst the rest of us get screwed.

This pasty tax will only lead to unrest. The natives in Wigan are getting very restless at this notion.

The government is to reverse its plans to impose VAT on Cornish pasties, the BBC has learned.

Ministers have also reduced the intended 20% charge which was due to be levied on static caravans to 5%.

The U-turn from Chancellor George Osborne's Budget follows protests by bakers and caravanning enthusiasts.

The government has altered the definition of what is a "hot" pasty to allow the reversal of its plans. Labour said ministers were "incompetent".

After the amendment, food such as sausage rolls or pasties sold on shelves - that is, cooling down, rather than being kept hot in a special cabinet - will not be liable for VAT.

More here -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-18244640

Wiganers, Carrs Pasties, Greenhalghs' and Gregs win on the day!!!!! Shame we don't ahve them over here :-(

The people of Wigan are out in force on the streets celebrating the u-turn by the government. Great news.

Lofty_Love wrote:your a few weeks late on this one

Anyway, when a country is in massive debt tax increases have to occur, its the same for every economy.

Most other hot food is already taxed, but yeah I can see why this could be seen as a bit silly, but its also understandable.

I feel a tax on oysters and Foie gras would be more appropriate...

however, when this was suggested, David Cameron was outraged, he said...

''oh no, hang on...that's not what the 'poor people' eat, hell no, we cant tax our shit anymore, dont talk to me about money not stretching as far, we Tories also have more than enough hardship in our lives currently, ive had to recently make my man servant take a pay cut - hes not happy at all and let my personal arse wiping assistant go...we are all in this together and the tax on the staple snack of the working classes is a fair way to do it I feel...now, were is that number for my moet-et-chandon rep, I need to order the drinks in for our next conservative jolly''

that BBC article to me does not sound like a turnaround, it will go ahead.

ok...maybe it is a U-turn... in a way, provided a shop has shelves to leave the pies out on...woe-betide anyone who orders a pastie thats just getting taken out of the oven though...

Hat, you say Labour over invested in the public sector. Not true. Labour's investment in the NHS, schools the police etc was inline with growth about 3% - 3.5% pa on average. Let's not forget when Labour came to power in '97' the fabric of the country had been neglected by the Tories for years. NHS patients left on hospital trolleys, schools with over 40 to a class and leaky roofs. I can remember pictures of the police using dustbin lids as riot shields. All happened under the Tories.

The wheels came off the economy when the banks had to be bailed out, and I mean, had to. Had the chancellor, Alister Darling, not pumped in billions, when people put their card in a cash machine, nothing would have come out. The q's' we saw outside Northern Rock would have been repeated outside every bank in the country. There would have been panic on the streets. Darling deserves credit for acting as swiftly as he did.

The gold sale thing, well who knows when the right time to sell is, it's all easy with you know what. Brown took the view that public services were more important than assets just lying there.

chipbutty wrote:Hat, you say Labour over invested in the public sector. Not true. Labour's investment in the NHS, schools the police etc was inline with growth about 3% - 3.5% pa on average. Let's not forget when Labour came to power in '97' the fabric of the country had been neglected by the Tories for years. NHS patients left on hospital trolleys, schools with over 40 to a class and leaky roofs. I can remember pictures of the police using dustbin lids as riot shields. All happened under the Tories.

The wheels came off the economy when the banks had to be bailed out, and I mean, had to. Had the chancellor, Alister Darling, not pumped in billions, when people put their card in a cash machine, nothing would have come out. The q's' we saw outside Northern Rock would have been repeated outside every bank in the country. There would have been panic on the streets. Darling deserves credit for acting as swiftly as he did.

The gold sale thing, well who knows when the right time to sell is, it's all easy with you know what. Brown took the view that public services were more important than assets just lying there.

fantastic post

Let me guess... your on a day off work today?

Two good posts from Chipbutty and LH. Let the discussion begin My own view was that I expected a pinching of the purse when Tories came in, and even though I voted for them, I'm bitterly disappointed with their performance so far. Backtracking on the pasty tax will cost the government £65 M. This is nothing compared to the damage in confidence of the nation in the governments ability to get us out of this hole., and just at a time when the IMF is telling us to start 'Plan B'. Obviously Plan A has now run its course.

I'm glad we never sold the Pound down the river and opted for the Euro. It was only a no vote from the Danes that preventing us from going in at the start.

The bottom line for me is that I don't trust any politicians whether they be red, blue or orange. They all talk shite.

RT, are you looking forward to having Prince Charles' head on our currency?

bwfc71 wrote:RT, are you looking forward to having Prince Charles' head on our currency?

Speaking for myself I'd prefer to handle a Prince Charles than a Prince Albert any day.

Sluffy wrote:

bwfc71 wrote:RT, are you looking forward to having Prince Charles' head on our currency?

Speaking for myself I'd prefer to handle a Prince Charles than a Prince Albert any day.

Now now Sluffy, don't make BH jealous!

I would never entertain a Prince Albert. Years ago you could get away with one because most jeans had buttons but nowadays with all these zips you are asking for trouble.