OFFICIAL - Arsenal sign Rob Holding

bwfc1874 wrote:Can't ever blame a footballer for backing themselves and having a go at the big time. Arsenal vs. Bournemouth is a no brainer let's face it, more money (and London to spend it in), better quality of coaching, world class facilities, the opportunity to play with some of the best players in the world, the chance to win trophies and play in the Champions League.

Good on him and I hope he makes it to the big time.

Well said. He is giving himself the best possible opportunity to succeed at the highest level. Good luck to the lad.

bwfc1874 wrote:Arsenal give young players a chance, whether or not they take it is down to them and their ability but that's my point about backing oneself, you cannot blame Holding for doing so. It's too easy for fans to look from a distance and say oh he'd be better off at a smaller club. Arsenal are weak at centre half and there's every chance he'll get a run when Mertesacker or Koscielny are inevitably injured or suspended. 

You mention Chambers as an example but he had a good run at CB and after an initial good start went off the boil, he's been a victim of Bellerin's emergence for his natural RB position.

I disagree I think for everyone that get's a chance many don't. There are many clubs in the PL where he would get a better chance to play games IMO, and that would give him a great chance of a big move in the not too distant future when he would be readier for that jump a la Stones, and by playing more regularly of getting noticed for England who also appear to have a dearth of CB talent at the moment.

I think you're missing my point.

Everyone knows that plenty of players don't make the grade at top clubs - that's why they're top clubs. 

What I'm saying is you cannot blame a player for backing himself to be one of the very best who do end up making the grade.

You seem to think going to Arsenal will harm his England chances, I disagree, if he wasn't already on the England watch list he certainly is now. Like it or not the top clubs get preference when selecting England players (not something I agree with) - Holding has done himself a world of good and don't undervalue the difference top quality coaching makes. The choice between Arsenal and Bournemouth is a simple one IMO.

bwfc1874 wrote:I think you're missing my point.

Everyone knows that plenty of players don't make the grade at top clubs - that's why they're top clubs. 

What I'm saying is you cannot blame a player for backing himself to be one of the very best who do end up making the grade.

You seem to think going to Arsenal will harm his England chances, I disagree, if he wasn't already on the England watch list he certainly is now. Like it or not the top clubs get preference when selecting England players (not something I agree with) - Holding has done himself a world of good and don't undervalue the difference top quality coaching makes. The choice between Arsenal and Bournemouth is a simple one IMO.

You keep saying Arsenal and Bournemouth, there are Southampton, Everton, Tottenham (although Alderweireld and Vertonghen would take some shifting), West Ham all who play young players.
You feel Arsenal is his best option and I don't, only time will tell.

There are also Barcelona, AC Milan and Real Madrid whilst you're at it. 

But I was talking about clubs who had actually shown an interest and made a bid, Holding doesn't get to just pick whichever club he wants!

Everton, Tottenham and Southampton have been credited with an interest as have Bournemouth, the PL club supposed to have bid on him other than Arsenal supposedly wasn't Bournemouth.

whatsgoingon wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:I think you're missing my point.

Everyone knows that plenty of players don't make the grade at top clubs - that's why they're top clubs. 

What I'm saying is you cannot blame a player for backing himself to be one of the very best who do end up making the grade.

You seem to think going to Arsenal will harm his England chances, I disagree, if he wasn't already on the England watch list he certainly is now. Like it or not the top clubs get preference when selecting England players (not something I agree with) - Holding has done himself a world of good and don't undervalue the difference top quality coaching makes. The choice between Arsenal and Bournemouth is a simple one IMO.

You keep saying Arsenal and Bournemouth, there are Southampton, Everton, Tottenham (although Alderweireld and Vertonghen would take some shifting), West Ham all who play young players.
You feel Arsenal is his best option and I don't, only time will tell.

I'm with '74 on this. He's young and he wants to make it to the top and Arsenal have shown they have confidence in him by putting the money on the table so it's up to him to grab his chance. And if he doesn't make it, moving on from Arsenal will probably get him a choice of clubs and better personal terms because of the perception that all their players have quality.

Which reminds me, what happened to Ryo Miyaichi? He's one who seems to have sunk without a trace.

Hm not from what I've read but maybe your sources are closer to the mark. Even so, the amount of young players who go and don't make it at Everton and Spurs is comparable to Arsenal so your point doesn't make much sense I'm afraid.

wanderlust wrote:

whatsgoingon wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:I think you're missing my point.

Everyone knows that plenty of players don't make the grade at top clubs - that's why they're top clubs. 

What I'm saying is you cannot blame a player for backing himself to be one of the very best who do end up making the grade.

You seem to think going to Arsenal will harm his England chances, I disagree, if he wasn't already on the England watch list he certainly is now. Like it or not the top clubs get preference when selecting England players (not something I agree with) - Holding has done himself a world of good and don't undervalue the difference top quality coaching makes. The choice between Arsenal and Bournemouth is a simple one IMO.

You keep saying Arsenal and Bournemouth, there are Southampton, Everton, Tottenham (although Alderweireld and Vertonghen would take some shifting), West Ham all who play young players.
You feel Arsenal is his best option and I don't, only time will tell.

I'm with '74 on this. He's young and he wants to make it to the top and Arsenal have shown they have confidence in him by putting the money on the table so it's up to him to grab his chance. And if he doesn't make it, moving on from Arsenal will probably get him a choice of clubs and better personal terms because of the perception that all their players have quality.

Which reminds me, what happened to Ryo Miyaichi? He's one who seems to have sunk without a trace.

Last seen turning out for FC St Pauli! 

Guess Nat was right on this one.

bwfc1874 wrote:Hm not from what I've read but maybe your sources are closer to the mark. Even so, the amount of young players who go and don't make it at Everton and Spurs is comparable to Arsenal so your point doesn't make much sense I'm afraid.

It does when you look back over all the examples, maybe it doesn't make sense to you but that isn't important to me.
As I said time will tell whether it's a good move or a bad move.
It also isn't just Arsenal this applies to City and Chelsea are equally guilty of buying for the sake of buying hoping that one or two make it.

I think that the important thing here is that we have a Chairman who is apparently sticking to his guns re sale price which means we will hopefully start getting what our players are worth for the first time in years. 
If he can also buy well we may turn the corner financially.
I mean good luck to Rob and all, but this move is all about what it does for BWFC.

wanderlust wrote:I think that the important thing here is that we have a Chairman who is apparently sticking to his guns re sale price which means we will hopefully start getting what our players are worth for the first time in years. 
If he can also buy well we may turn the corner financially.
I mean good luck to Rob and all, but this move is all about what it does for BWFC.

We have always been fleeced by agents in the past hopefully having one as chairman will make the hard nosed nature of agents work in our favour for once

Other clubs may have expressed an interest but that's not the same as saying they put money on the table wgo. While I do take your point about Arsenal being more likely to loan him out in the short term at least I think Holding would be crazy not to take the money they're likely to offer him or the opportunity it might represent for his long term career. Personally I would have preferred to keep him but that was a non-starter if we're realistic. One possible benefit is that if Arsenal do decide to loan him out he could well wind up here next season anyway. It's certainly worth hoping for.

luckyPeterpiper wrote:Other clubs may have expressed an interest but that's not the same as saying they put money on the table wgo. 

No I get that, allegedly one other club not Arsenal and not Bournemouth did put an offer in but it's all speculation.
From our point of view an Everton or Southampton would be better too because bonuses are generally based on appearances and sell on and we would have more chance of racking up the bonus payments away from Arsenal.
Digressing slightly but Barnsley could be set to receive £7.5m from the sale of John Stones to City.

whatsgoingon wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:Hm not from what I've read but maybe your sources are closer to the mark. Even so, the amount of young players who go and don't make it at Everton and Spurs is comparable to Arsenal so your point doesn't make much sense I'm afraid.

It does when you look back over all the examples, maybe it doesn't make sense to you but that isn't important to me.
As I said time will tell whether it's a good move or a bad move.
It also isn't just Arsenal this applies to City and Chelsea are equally guilty of buying for the sake of buying hoping that one or two make it.

You haven't looked back over all of the examples though have you? 

Everton and Tottenham do the exact same thing, take a punt on lower league players for cheap and see how they develop. If they don't they invariably get flogged on. 

Ever heard of John Bostock?

It's about how good a player individually is, and fair play to Holding for backing himself to become one of the best.

wanderlust wrote:I think that the important thing here is that we have a Chairman who is apparently sticking to his guns re sale price which means we will hopefully start getting what our players are worth for the first time in years. 
If he can also buy well we may turn the corner financially.
I mean good luck to Rob and all, but this move is all about what it does for BWFC.

If Holding is the best thing since sliced bread then isn't he worth a lot more than 2 mill ?

Good luck to him naturally. Who wouldn't want to sign for Arsenal. He will be loaned out in mid-season..probably not to us though.

bwfc1874 wrote:

whatsgoingon wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:Hm not from what I've read but maybe your sources are closer to the mark. Even so, the amount of young players who go and don't make it at Everton and Spurs is comparable to Arsenal so your point doesn't make much sense I'm afraid.

It does when you look back over all the examples, maybe it doesn't make sense to you but that isn't important to me.
As I said time will tell whether it's a good move or a bad move.
It also isn't just Arsenal this applies to City and Chelsea are equally guilty of buying for the sake of buying hoping that one or two make it.

You haven't looked back over all of the examples though have you? 

Everton and Tottenham do the exact same thing, take a punt on lower league players for cheap and see how they develop. If they don't they invariably get flogged on. 

Ever heard of John Bostock?

It's about how good a player individually is, and fair play to Holding for backing himself to become one of the best.

I genuinely hope it works out for him, only time will tell

bwfc1874 wrote:Guess Nat was right on this one.

I know a lightweight ponce when I see one.

Natasha Whittam wrote:

bwfc1874 wrote:Guess Nat was right on this one.

I know a lightweight ponce when I see one.

If you call every player a lightweight ponce sooner or later you're going to get one right.
Even a stopped clock's right twice a day

Personally I think the deal is (on the surface at least) a good one all round. Arsenal get a young promising English defender for a small initial fee (in their terms) and we get a fair bit more on top if he works out plus (according to SSN) a sell on clause. Holding gets a crack at the big time, maybe even a real shot at international football and a much bigger wage than we could offer. Whether or not everyone really will win in the end will be down to him and whether or not he makes it. Good luck to the lad, I hope for his sake and ours that he does very well.