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Lennon or Lemon?

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Bollotom2014
Bwfc1958
Chairmanda
Natasha Whittam
Boggersbelief
Norpig
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Lennon or Lemon

Lennon or Lemon? Vote_lcap94%Lennon or Lemon? Vote_rcap 94% [ 15 ]
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1Lennon or Lemon? Empty Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 13:33

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In five days time it will be Lennon's one year anniversary at the club :party: so it seems fitting to have a review of how he's doing so far.

After an initial bounce last season and getting us out of relegation danger we really tailed off, following that with a frustrating summer and this season has kicked off in a similar fashion to last with only 1 win leaving us in the relegation places.

One school of thought seems to absolve the manager of any blame and instead focuses on the financial constraints he's under. Personally I think that's a bit lenient as Freedman was never allowed that one. 

My main worry this season is that we're not showing the energy we saw when Lennon first took over, effort and organisation will make up for a lack of talent in this league (see Birmingham City for this) neither seem to have markedly improved and Mjalby leaving may not help that either.

So what do you think? Is he a Lemon or just Lennon?

2Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 13:45

Norpig

Norpig
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

i'll give him the benefit of the doubt for now as he really has had his hands tied behind his back, Freedman had more resources than Lennon in my opinion and times are a lot harder now than even a year ago.
To be honest as long as we avoid relegation this year that will be an achievement, that's how far we have fallen in the last few years  Sad

3Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 14:07

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Guest

My worry is that the players are slipping back into their old ways again, a soft touch who other sides aren't worried about facing.

Now Ameobi has fallen through it seems we won't be bringing anybody else in, so Lennon has to get more out of what he has. First thing I'd do is play a defensive midfielder who can help protect the back 4 but he also needs to find a solution to our goal problem, maybe Johnny's right and one of the kids needs to be given a go.

4Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 14:39

Boggersbelief

Boggersbelief
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

The plan is to wait as long as possible to bring a striker in. To make full use of the loan system

5Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 14:51

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

We're seeing just what a limited manager Lennon is right now. Anyone could manage Celtic with all their millions in a league of sub-standard players.

Managing a club on a budget in a league full of bigger and more ambitious clubs is beyond him. It's all very well pointing to the lack of funds, but what funds he has had have been spent on utter crap.

I'd get rid now before we end up routed in the bottom 3.

6Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 14:56

Guest


Guest

bwfc1874 wrote:My worry is that the players are slipping back into their old ways again, a soft touch who other sides aren't worried about facing.

Now Ameobi has fallen through it seems we won't be bringing anybody else in, so Lennon has to get more out of what he has. First thing I'd do is play a defensive midfielder who can help protect the back 4 but he also needs to find a solution to our goal problem, maybe Johnny's right and one of the kids needs to be given a go.

I think so. Even Thomas who's older than samizadeh knows where the net is. Madine has started to look better but paired with a youngster who can do all the running and hit the target he will look better.

Lennon is unfortunate that he came to our club when he did. Whatever false promises he was given by whoever, whether he sticks with it,  walks out or is pushed,  it will have a detrimental affect on his career going forward. We was hard to score against and look really good at the back at one point but yet again injuries/suspensions have harmed the progress and we are back to square two. Not one because because although the defence has gone to shit we have looked slightly better up top.

Is it a case that we can only work at one part of the pitch per game?

Is the midfield pushing forward helping the strikers leaving the defence vulnerable?

Has Doris put a hex on the team for saying the tea isn't upto scratch?

Who the fook knows.

Lennon should. And he should be doing his upmost to get the best out of what he has to work with and recent evidence of this isn't supporting him.

7Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 15:03

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Guest

He certainly made some strange signings last season, Twardzik, Slavchaev and Rochinha, all 3 contributing next to nothing. Having said that, I do think he's had the right idea in terms of recruitment over summer and I'll give him a pass on the striker situation as we've been knocked back so many times for reasons out of his control. Better not to panic and instead wait until the right deal comes up now.

I think you need to judge a manager beyond his recruitment though, we're still not organised at the back and we're really not playing with the sort of tempo and high pressing Lennon's appointment initially brought. Basically it comes down to work rate and fitness, both of which have to be drilled into the players.

8Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 15:05

Guest


Guest

y2johnny wrote:
bwfc1874 wrote:My worry is that the players are slipping back into their old ways again, a soft touch who other sides aren't worried about facing.

Now Ameobi has fallen through it seems we won't be bringing anybody else in, so Lennon has to get more out of what he has. First thing I'd do is play a defensive midfielder who can help protect the back 4 but he also needs to find a solution to our goal problem, maybe Johnny's right and one of the kids needs to be given a go.

I think so. Even Thomas who's older than samizadeh knows where the net is. Madine has started to look better but paired with a youngster who can do all the running and hit the target he will look better.

Lennon is unfortunate that he came to our club when he did. Whatever false promises he was given by whoever, whether he sticks with it,  walks out or is pushed,  it will have a detrimental affect on his career going forward. We was hard to score against and look really good at the back at one point but yet again injuries/suspensions have harmed the progress and we are back to square two. Not one because because although the defence has gone to shit we have looked slightly better up top.

Is it a case that we can only work at one part of the pitch per game?

Is the midfield pushing forward helping the strikers leaving the defence vulnerable?

Has Doris put a hex on the team for saying the tea isn't upto scratch?

Who the fook knows.

Lennon should. And he should be doing his upmost to get the best out of what he has to work with and recent evidence of this isn't supporting him.

At the very least playing Thomas or Samizadeh would bring a bit of excitement to the fans, maybe he's waiting for a low risk cup game to do it? I just think we're lacking a bit of energy at the moment.

9Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 15:07

Guest


Guest

bwfc1874 wrote:
y2johnny wrote:
bwfc1874 wrote:My worry is that the players are slipping back into their old ways again, a soft touch who other sides aren't worried about facing.

Now Ameobi has fallen through it seems we won't be bringing anybody else in, so Lennon has to get more out of what he has. First thing I'd do is play a defensive midfielder who can help protect the back 4 but he also needs to find a solution to our goal problem, maybe Johnny's right and one of the kids needs to be given a go.

I think so. Even Thomas who's older than samizadeh knows where the net is. Madine has started to look better but paired with a youngster who can do all the running and hit the target he will look better.

Lennon is unfortunate that he came to our club when he did. Whatever false promises he was given by whoever, whether he sticks with it,  walks out or is pushed,  it will have a detrimental affect on his career going forward. We was hard to score against and look really good at the back at one point but yet again injuries/suspensions have harmed the progress and we are back to square two. Not one because because although the defence has gone to shit we have looked slightly better up top.

Is it a case that we can only work at one part of the pitch per game?

Is the midfield pushing forward helping the strikers leaving the defence vulnerable?

Has Doris put a hex on the team for saying the tea isn't upto scratch?

Who the fook knows.

Lennon should. And he should be doing his upmost to get the best out of what he has to work with and recent evidence of this isn't supporting him.

At the very least playing Thomas or Samizadeh would bring a bit of excitement to the fans, maybe he's waiting for a low risk cup game to do it? I just think we're lacking a bit of energy at the moment.

I agree.  Look at the boost clough gave us last season.  A younger hungrier player will be better than a journeyman pay cheque picker upperer

10Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 17:04

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

We have no viable alternative other than to play the long game which is to try to hang around in this division until either our youngsters come through and turn out to be better than what we currently have or a rich person buys the club. 

We tried changing the manager and that hasn't changed anything results-wise so I really don't see the point in doing it again....and again...and again.

At least there will be a focus of direction, a long term plan and some degree of consistency if we can stick with the same manager for the next few years. No guarantee of success but it has to have a better chance than changing the manager as often as Nat changes her knickers. 

We just have to put up with short term pain and the screaming fishwife of Preston until we turn the corner.

11Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 17:13

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

wanderlust wrote:We have no viable alternative other than to play the long game which is to try to hang around in this division until either our youngsters come through and turn out to be better than what we currently have or a rich person buys the club. 


That is just utter bollocks.

When we had a manager who could spot talent without spending millions (Bruce Ricoh) we shot up the league.

Money helps of course, but having a good manager who can spot talent is just as important.

Too many managers bleat about lack of funds but when did how much money you had dictate how good a manager you are?

12Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 17:21

Boggersbelief

Boggersbelief
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

We don't have the funds to buy the talent nat you idiot. Back in Riochs days players didn't cost very much, compared to now when you have to pay £9 million for someone like Dwight Gayle.

Get your head out your arse

13Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 18:00

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Boggersbelief wrote:We don't have the funds to buy the talent nat you idiot. Back in Riochs days players didn't cost very much, compared to now when you have to pay £9 million for someone like Dwight Gayle.

Get your head out your arse

I was dishing out football wisdom when you were still coming through the turkey baster you little shite, so watch the lip.

Players obviously cost more these days, but so does everything else you utter belled. It's called inflation. Look it up.

The fact is Rioch put together a team on a budget because he could spot talent. But that was the olden days when managers had to actually manage rather than be a slave to the chequebook.

14Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Wed Oct 07 2015, 18:32

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Guest

The truth is in the middle really, Lennon's hands are tied and getting above teams with budgets so much bigger than ours would be a miracle. As I've said before I can't remember the last side to get promoted whilst cutting their budget as drastically as we've had to year on year.

Having said that it's undeniable that a club with our resources and squad should be performing better than we are, nobody's expecting a play off push but bottom 3 and one win all season isn't good enough.

15Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Thu Oct 08 2015, 09:37

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Natasha Whittam wrote:
wanderlust wrote:We have no viable alternative other than to play the long game which is to try to hang around in this division until either our youngsters come through and turn out to be better than what we currently have or a rich person buys the club. 


That is just utter bollocks.

When we had a manager who could spot talent without spending millions (Bruce Ricoh) we shot up the league.

Money helps of course, but having a good manager who can spot talent is just as important.

Too many managers bleat about lack of funds but when did how much money you had dictate how good a manager you are?
This is just utter bollocks.
It took Bruce two years to create a team playing in the 3rd and 2nd tiers to drive the momentum towards promotion culminating in the Reading playoff in his third year. Great days but the fact is that we were at a lower level AND more importantly he was given time. And money where required.

Which is the case with all the successful managers we've had. Just look how much time and money Fat Sam was given.

There's a direct correlation between success and the manager being given time and money.
Conversely, every time we've sacked the manager for going through a bad patch recently, the next one hasn't improved things. Because the state of the club hasn't changed and we still can't give them money - but we could give them time.

16Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Thu Oct 08 2015, 10:52

Chairmanda

Chairmanda
Andy Walker
Andy Walker

wanderlust wrote:
Natasha Whittam wrote:
wanderlust wrote:We have no viable alternative other than to play the long game which is to try to hang around in this division until either our youngsters come through and turn out to be better than what we currently have or a rich person buys the club. 


That is just utter bollocks.

When we had a manager who could spot talent without spending millions (Bruce Ricoh) we shot up the league.

Money helps of course, but having a good manager who can spot talent is just as important.

Too many managers bleat about lack of funds but when did how much money you had dictate how good a manager you are?
This is just utter bollocks.
It took Bruce two years to create a team playing in the 3rd and 2nd tiers to drive the momentum towards promotion culminating in the Reading playoff in his third year. Great days but the fact is that we were at a lower level AND more importantly he was given time. And money where required.

Which is the case with all the successful managers we've had. Just look how much time and money Fat Sam was given.

There's a direct correlation between success and the manager being given time and money.
Conversely, every time we've sacked the manager for going through a bad patch recently, the next one hasn't improved things. Because the state of the club hasn't changed and we still can't give them money - but we could give them time.
:agree:

17Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Thu Oct 08 2015, 11:29

Bwfc1958

Bwfc1958
Tinned Toms - You know it makes sense!

wanderlust wrote:
Natasha Whittam wrote:
wanderlust wrote:We have no viable alternative other than to play the long game which is to try to hang around in this division until either our youngsters come through and turn out to be better than what we currently have or a rich person buys the club. 


That is just utter bollocks.

When we had a manager who could spot talent without spending millions (Bruce Ricoh) we shot up the league.

Money helps of course, but having a good manager who can spot talent is just as important.

Too many managers bleat about lack of funds but when did how much money you had dictate how good a manager you are?
This is just utter bollocks.
It took Bruce two years to create a team playing in the 3rd and 2nd tiers to drive the momentum towards promotion culminating in the Reading playoff in his third year. Great days but the fact is that we were at a lower level AND more importantly he was given time. And money where required.

Which is the case with all the successful managers we've had. Just look how much time and money Fat Sam was given.

There's a direct correlation between success and the manager being given time and money.
Conversely, every time we've sacked the manager for going through a bad patch recently, the next one hasn't improved things. Because the state of the club hasn't changed and we still can't give them money - but we could give them time.
Spot on Lusty. Sacking Lennon now would achieve nothing. There isn't a manager in the world who could turn us into a great side without a ton of money to throw at it. We are where we are as a club and the only thing we have going for us is a young manager with great potential. The only way forward is to bide our time and give the manager time to play the long game.

Man Utd were on the verge of sacking Fergie around 1990 and look what happened given time. Very different scenarios financially but there is a lot to be said for consistency and continuity. 

Anyone who thinks we should change manager ato this point is an idiot.

18Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Thu Oct 08 2015, 12:37

Bollotom2014

Bollotom2014
Andy Walker
Andy Walker

Give Samizadeh a go. Pointless leaving him in the under 18s/21s until we go to Div1. If he's good enough he's good enough. No use protecting him from the "Big boys". He's probably quick enough to get away from trouble.

19Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Thu Oct 08 2015, 12:49

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Bollotom2014 wrote:Give Samizadeh a go. Pointless leaving him in the under 18s/21s until we go to Div1. If he's good enough he's good enough. No use protecting him from the "Big boys". He's probably quick enough to get away from trouble.
I would personally fast track him to the bench and give him a shot from there to get the ball rolling as providing he doesn't get injured, there's nothing to lose. I suspect he's a bit lightweight but at least he has a decent chance of tucking it away if he gets a chance.
That said, I wouldn't throw him in ahead of Clayton straight away and there's no way Lennon will dispense with Madine or another target man apparently.

20Lennon or Lemon? Empty Re: Lennon or Lemon? Thu Oct 08 2015, 13:06

Guest


Guest

he's bigger than clough and clayton.  probably put together, so not lightweight.

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