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Brexit negotiations

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gloswhite
Sluffy
finlaymcdanger
Buellix
Hipster_Nebula
bryan458
wessy
luckyPeterpiper
rammywhite
Natasha Whittam
Dunkels King
okocha
bwfc71
Cajunboy
boltonbonce
wanderlust
20 posters

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21Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Mon Feb 25 2019, 13:21

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

gloswhite wrote:
T.R.O.Y wrote:What is it you want for the country Glos?
In a nutshell TROY, I would like us to be masters of our own destiny. Free to make our own decisions, as well as our own mistakes. 
We can see how the abilities of the ruling class have deteriorated during this Brexit process, and if we were to stay in the EU, they would only get worse, leaving all major decisions, and some minor as time rolls on, to the unelected bureaucrats in Brussels.
If we ignore this opportunity, we will be subsumed into the European experiment, never to be a truly independent country again.
Whilst I admire the sentiment of what you are saying, the problem is that other countries - whether they are in the EU or not - are also "masters of their own destiny". That would be fair enough if it wasn't for the fact that foreign companies operating in the UK contribute to 29% of the UK's GVA.
Many have been attracted here by successive Governments offering favourable terms after the traditional British companies failed and were sold off.  Moreover  our membership of the EU ensured zero tariffs on goods and parts and ease of movement of parts and finished goods to and from the continent, so the moment we start throwing up borders and introducing tariffs they will pull out - a process that has already started.
Millions and millions of jobs are at risk and we already know by their very presence that UK companies are not capable of filling the gap - we are simply not efficient enough and we have lost the advantage of Empire that propped up the economy until about 50 years ago.
The bottom line is that nowadays we are far more dependent on foreign companies than they are on us. They control our energy supply, our food supply and key industries notably automotive  which employs nearly a million people on it's own and all that is being put at risk on the notion that we are able to somehow backfill. We don't even own the major British brands anymore and how the hell British farmers are expected to feed us when they already depend massively on EU subsidies is beyond imagination. 
I pray it doesn't go totally tits up but a stupid gamble like Brexit is putting everything on the line including our health service, pensions, education system, care system and security.

22Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Mon Feb 25 2019, 18:21

Guest


Guest

Corbyn to back second referendum, little option left given May’s current direction. It’s either that or No deal.

Vote Labour.

23Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Mon Feb 25 2019, 18:24

Guest


Guest

*on condition of Labours Brexit deal amendment being rejected that is. So that would basically be all avenues for a deal exhausted and little choice left.

24Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Mon Feb 25 2019, 19:21

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Ha ha. He's finally come clean about his intentions.

Labour wish to stay in the EU.

25Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Mon Feb 25 2019, 20:37

okocha

okocha
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf

wanderlust wrote:
gloswhite wrote:
T.R.O.Y wrote:What is it you want for the country Glos?
In a nutshell TROY, I would like us to be masters of our own destiny. Free to make our own decisions, as well as our own mistakes. 
We can see how the abilities of the ruling class have deteriorated during this Brexit process, and if we were to stay in the EU, they would only get worse, leaving all major decisions, and some minor as time rolls on, to the unelected bureaucrats in Brussels.
If we ignore this opportunity, we will be subsumed into the European experiment, never to be a truly independent country again.
Whilst I admire the sentiment of what you are saying, the problem is that other countries - whether they are in the EU or not - are also "masters of their own destiny". That would be fair enough if it wasn't for the fact that foreign companies operating in the UK contribute to 29% of the UK's GVA.
Many have been attracted here by successive Governments offering favourable terms after the traditional British companies failed and were sold off.  Moreover  our membership of the EU ensured zero tariffs on goods and parts and ease of movement of parts and finished goods to and from the continent, so the moment we start throwing up borders and introducing tariffs they will pull out - a process that has already started.
Millions and millions of jobs are at risk and we already know by their very presence that UK companies are not capable of filling the gap - we are simply not efficient enough and we have lost the advantage of Empire that propped up the economy until about 50 years ago.
The bottom line is that nowadays we are far more dependent on foreign companies than they are on us. They control our energy supply, our food supply and key industries notably automotive  which employs nearly a million people on it's own and all that is being put at risk on the notion that we are able to somehow backfill. We don't even own the major British brands anymore and how the hell British farmers are expected to feed us when they already depend massively on EU subsidies is beyond imagination. 
I pray it doesn't go totally tits up but a stupid gamble like Brexit is putting everything on the line including our health service, pensions, education system, care system and security.
:clap:

26Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Feb 26 2019, 13:25

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

And here it is. As predicted months ago, the choice the Government will be offering is No Deal or May's deal.

27Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Feb 26 2019, 13:48

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Or a delay aka continued membership.

28Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Feb 26 2019, 14:27

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Hipster_Nebula wrote:Or a delay aka continued membership.
..but not the Norway - style deal that half of Leave voters voted for on the back of promises made by all the leaders of the Leave campaign.

29Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Feb 26 2019, 14:43

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Do you cut and paste that.

30Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Tue Feb 26 2019, 22:38

xmiles

xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
Jay Jay Okocha

Even the government admits that a no deal brexit will be a disaster:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47379308

31Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Wed Feb 27 2019, 13:28

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

xmiles wrote:Even the government admits that a no deal brexit will be a disaster:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47379308
It's more of a threat than an admission. How else do you think they'll push May's crap deal through if they don't highlight that the only choices they'll allow to be discussed are either a) crap or b) worse?

32Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Wed Feb 27 2019, 16:35

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

It's all a guess.

33Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Thu Feb 28 2019, 15:39

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

I guess the prospect of leaving the EU isn't going to slow down immigration given the latest figures.

34Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Thu Feb 28 2019, 17:32

xmiles

xmiles
Jay Jay Okocha
Jay Jay Okocha

wanderlust wrote:I guess the prospect of leaving the EU isn't going to slow down immigration given the latest figures.

Yes it's ironic that all those racists who voted leave are going to see more non-European immigrants now to replace the EU workers the country needs.

35Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Fri Mar 01 2019, 01:17

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

From the New York Times:

LONDON — Brexit. Brexit? Brexit! BREXIT!? The Backstop! Norway Plus! Canada Minus? The Cooper Amendment! The Malthouse Compromise? The Kyle-Wilson Amendment! Hard Brexit! Soft Brexit! No deal? Brexiteer! Remoaner! BREXIT!!?? Aaaargh.
It has come down to this with a few weeks to go until the March 29 deadline for Britain to leave the European Union, as it voted to do almost three years ago: a jumble of jargon, jousting and gibberish, with everyone sucked into the vortex of confusion, to the exclusion of every other issue in the world. Britain’s biggest political parties are splintering, and there is clarity only on the fact that nobody has a clue what is about to happen.
So much for the panacea offered in 2016 by leaders of the Vote Leave campaign — a land of milk and honey in which an island liberated from European shackles would become “Global Britain,” money would flow, impetigo would be cured, children would become more beautiful, the soil more bountiful, and the world Britain’s oyster. These days, the fantasy has sagged into a mumbled, “Well, Brexit is not the end of the world.” So much for the “Take Back Control” slogan Brexiteers wielded in 2016 to foist every frustration of voters onto Brussels. In fact, the best the Tory government could come up with over negotiations consuming the entire political energy (and untold treasure) of this country is a kick-the-can measure designed to avert the calamity of a no-deal Brexit.
This, absent an accord or deferral, would involve Britain crashing out of the union on March 29 into a void. Bring it on! So say the hard-line Tories in May’s party, their appetite for destruction not yet sated. Many of them are members of the European Research Group, an entity whose anodyne name masks its pro-Brexit zeal. It has apparently never heard of a multinational supply chain.
Honda’s recent decision to close a plant in Swindon with the loss of 3,500 jobs — unrelated, it says, to Brexit (ha-ha) — and Nissan’s recent retrenchment are signs, along with slower growth and lower investment, of the price Britain has already paid for uncertainty. No-deal Brexit would turn uncertainty into mayhem.




[size=15]So May maneuvers to save her deal, chiefly by adjusting the “backstop,” an insurance policy to preserve an open border in Ireland that has enraged hard-line Brexiteers because they see it as a Trojan horse for keeping Britain in the customs union through all eternity.
Jeremy Corbyn, the feckless Labour leader, maneuvers to keep his fingerprint off the British exit he not-so-secretly favors, while the majority of his party wants to remain in the European Union and eight M.P.s quit to form an independent group in Parliament to protest his policies.
Yvette Cooper, a leading Labour politician, [size=15]pushes a bill to defer the March 29 deadline; and two other Labour M.P.s, Peter Kyle and Phil Wilson, have drawn up an amendment that would see the House of Commons approve May’s accord on condition that it is put to a second referendum. (As for the Malthouse Compromise and forms of a soft or free-trade Brexit modeled on Norwegian or Canadian ties to the union, consign them, dear reader, to the vast T.M.I. Brexit archive).

The bottom line is simple: Brexit has been, is and will be a disaster for Britain. The 2016 vote was manipulated through lies. A country that has benefited from its 46-year participation in a union of more than a half-billion Europeans is drifting toward a self-amputation understood by few, opposed by the young, abetted by a dissembling anti-American Labour leader, driven by little-England Tory right-wingers holding the country for ransom, and, according to polls, no longer wanted by the majority.
Here are the odds in descending order of likelihood: An adjusted May accord secures parliamentary approval; the March 29 deadline is extended; no deal; a second referendum. Fight on! The best option, now that the country has sobered up, is to put Britain’s real future to a second people’s vote.[/size][/size]


PS. Looks like this article originated at the Financial Times.
Like many former British institutions, the FT is foreign owned (it's owned by Nikkei of Japanese Stock market fame) so can probably be passed off as fake news by nationalists.

36Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Fri Mar 01 2019, 11:00

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

37Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Fri Mar 01 2019, 11:21

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

May's Government: Another Brexit cock up costs the taxpayer £33 million to settle out of court for dodgy dealings.

38Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Fri Mar 01 2019, 12:28

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Remember this?

39Brexit negotiations - Page 2 Empty Re: Brexit negotiations Fri Mar 01 2019, 12:47

wanderlust

wanderlust
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

This chime with anyone?

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