Five and a half years of misery supporting BWFC

Big Sam left us five and a half years ago now and in that time we have had to endure sammy lee, Gary mugson, Owen coyle and dougie freedman. We have gone from having players like anelka, diouf, Nolan, campo, okocha, etc to this current shower of shite. Kevin Davies is still our main man ffs. We have tumbled down to looking at the relegation zone to the third tier.
Our players don't care. Can you imagine big Sam putting up with performances like the last two?

It's been just shite being a Bolton fan since Big Sam left. Where did it all go wrong? Who is to blame for how bad it's got? Or were we punching way above our weight under Big Sam and this is where we really belong?

Michael Bolton wrote:Big Sam left us five and a half years ago now and in that time we have had to endure sammy lee, Gary mugson, Owen coyle and dougie freedman. We have gone from having players like anelka, diouf, Nolan, campo, okocha, etc to this current shower of shite. Kevin Davies is still our main man ffs. We have tumbled down to looking at the relegation zone to the third tier.
Our players don't care. Can you imagine big Sam putting up with performances like the last two?

It's been just shite being a Bolton fan since Big Sam left. Where did it all go wrong? Who is to blame for how bad it's got? Or were we punching way above our weight under Big Sam and this is where we really belong?

70+ years of top flight football suggests thats the division we should always aim to be in. We may have punched above our weight with the top 8 finishes and euro qualification. At level 2 on the pyramid, we should be expecting a play-off place as a minimum.

As for who is to blame. Gartside appointed Lee, Megson, Coyle & Freedman. He didn't even want to sack Coyle, Eddie Davies forced him into doing it. I blame Garty. Time for a new chairman and heck, even a new board. (One that can appoint a decent manager and target good quality players with what little money we have off Eddie Davies these days!)

All eddies fault...bankrolled us then ran out of money....

Sam left because we fucked him off over money to get us even higher in the league

I don't blame gartside for the appointments of Coyle and DF as both looked to be promising young managers. Maybe we should have gone for mick McCarthy, ipswich are doing well under him now. I do think he should have sacked OC last November when we looked terrible and clueless.
I think if we fail to go up this season which looks a cert now, we should get rid of everyone and look to start again with kids from lower leagues who have some ability. We need players who are hungry to succeed. This current bunch of overpaid Charlie's don't give a shit.

Phil Gartside has to take responsibility for the state of affairs. Being in football doesn't mean you know football, you fat bastard.

Big Sam signed players like Okocha, Campo, Djorkaeff, etc, but it was only a short term fix, to keep us at the top end of the table. Financially, it just wasn't sustainable in the long run, for a club of our size.

I wanted Mick MCcarthy as Coyle's replacement, but he wasn't the most popular choice with a lot of Bolton fans, due to his record of having teams relegated from the Premier league. For me, we should have just taken one step at a time and just tried to get back to the Premier under a manager like MCcarthy first and If it wasn't going to plan part way through the season in the Premier(if he got us there) then address the situation accordingly if necessary.

If promotion isn't an option this season then why not take a chance on some of the youngsters. Joe Riley, O Halloran, Tom Eaves. Even bring Wylde back and give him a go. They can't do any worse.

Reebok_Rebel wrote:All eddies fault...bankrolled us then ran out of money....

Sam left because we fucked him off over money to get us even higher in the league

How can you put any of this on Eddie Davies, the guy has been the only person who has put money into the club for the past 10 years and you're having ago at him for it?

For me it starts with Gartside for picking the clueless pricks he put in charge after BSA, the managers who have follwed have been nothing short of a disaster for the club and have pissed away every penny Eddie Davies and the club has on god aweful players.

The state of the current set up of players right now has to be the worst I have seen in terms of ability and hunger to succeed in my life time.

Eddie has put the money up but he doesn't pick the team. It's a collective problem but it's up to the team to get things right. They are the ones who are earning the big salaries. They consider themselves professionals and it is up to them to act professionally where it counts...on the pitch.

There isn't one person to blame, it is a combination of factors but the owner and Gartside have to take the lions share.

If they weren't prepared to back Allardyce with money then why did they give it to Megson? Beggars belief.

The other way of looking at this is that all clubs go through stages of doing well and not so well, our target now is to make sure that this is the bottoming out season and we don't fall any further.

Culcheth_White wrote:Big Sam signed players like Okocha, Campo, Djorkaeff, etc, but it was only a short term fix, to keep us at the top end of the table. Financially, it just wasn't sustainable in the long run, for a club of our size.

I wanted Mick MCcarthy as Coyle's replacement, but he wasn't the most popular choice with a lot of Bolton fans, due to his record of having teams relegated from the Premier league. For me, we should have just taken one step at a time and just tried to get back to the Premier under a manager like MCcarthy first and If it wasn't going to plan part way through the season in the Premier(if he got us there) then address the situation accordingly if necessary.

I go along with this view.

Allardyce got us to the top but the way he did it left us broke - big money on 'old' players who once they passed their sell by date left us nothing to buy replacements with.

It's no coincidence to me that Sam 'jumped' when he did, he realised that we had peaked so to speak.

It left Lee no money to keep the ship afloat and all the 'new' Sky money from the next three year contract to be spent by Megson on over priced rubbish really - but they were just about good enough to keep us up.

I still believe if Megson had stayed we would still be clinging on in the Premier but most fans got their wish and he was sacked and we put all our remaining eggs into the Coyle basket - what a fucking disaster that was!

The man showed he was clueless with the team - same players and tactics every week, and with his signings - Pratley, Ngog, Sordell, Mills, Andrews, Ream, Mears, the resigning of Knight - the list is endless.

Gartside should have sacked him well over a year back and the fact that he wanted to give him a new contract and Davies had to over rule him and sack Coyle speaks volumes to me.

The thing that we should not lose sight if though is what the owners of the club (Davies by all accounts as nowhere near enough personal wealth as he has invested in the club - so the money simply as to be coming from some place else) may want may not be the same thing as we as fans may want.

We obviously want success - they probably are more concerned about the return on their investment.

As long as the money is there to pay the interest on the debt - then they do not have to rush to do anything drastic.

It may well be with the parachute payments we receive that they have written off this season (and who knows maybe even next!) and are concentrating on a longer term strategy to rebuild the club and go up again for a least one more season and thus have more parachute payments for the following years.

Not what we would want but I guess a feasible plan for those who are looking for a return on the money they have invested in the club.

Why else would Davies keep Gartside after allowing Coyle to fuck the club up player wise?

Culcheth_White wrote:Big Sam signed players like Okocha, Campo, Djorkaeff, etc, but it was only a short term fix, to keep us at the top end of the table. Financially, it just wasn't sustainable in the long run, for a club of our size.

Obviously we don't have the financial resources to compete in the top half of the Prem but the right manager with some money would have been able to keep us up. Just look at the way we almost stayed up last season.

What is unbelievable is just how bad we are currently. I am still prepared to give Dougie more time but I find it difficult to believe that there is any real strategic vision to get us back into the Prem. If you don't bounce back on the first attempt it gets harder as the money dries up and you lose your better players (I know - who?).

Dougie needs to do something pretty amazing in the second half of this season to make me think that we will be serious promotion contenders next season.

If we had stayed up last season then I think we would have really struggled with our current squad.

Reebok Trotter wrote:If we had stayed up last season then I think we would have really struggled with our current squad.

Plus we would more than likely still have Coyle and his family still in charge!!!

I do agree with those who say that although BSA did amazing for us, he knew the club were in a mess by the time he left.
Bolton: Jaaskelainen, Campo, Meite, Michalik, Gardner, Teymourian, Thompson (Vaz Te 46), Tal (Sinclair 77), Speed, Davies, Anelka (Martin 90).
Subs Not Used: Al Habsi, Augustyn.
Look at the line up for big sam's last game. Campo and Speed were finished. Michalik, meite, Thompson, tal, teymourian were all shit. Anelka wanted out. Big Sam left us with nothing. We had no young players to build the team around.
So was Big Sam's short term strategy to blame?

At least under Mugson we started signing young players with some talent - Cahill, Muamba, mark Davies, lee, etc. But then he blew loads on shit like Elmander, Sean Davis and Knight.

We should have brought back Colin Todd, he had an eye for a good signing!

Michael Bolton wrote: We had no young players to build the team around.

Nolan was only 24. Newcastle were and the current West Ham are largely built around him.

Referring to Allardyce having a "short term" strategy is ridiculous. He was with us for 8 years and took us out of obscurity in (what is now) the Championship into Europe, the top six in the Prem and a serious contender for both the League and FA cups. How is that short term? You cannnot maintain that level of success without money and for what ever reason that money was not forthcoming. I don't blame Allardyce for trying for the England job (he could hardly have been worse than McClaren) or walking away when he did.

Michael Bolton wrote:I do agree with those who say that although BSA did amazing for us, he knew the club were in a mess by the time he left.
Bolton: Jaaskelainen, Campo, Meite, Michalik, Gardner, Teymourian, Thompson (Vaz Te 46), Tal (Sinclair 77), Speed, Davies, Anelka (Martin 90).
Subs Not Used: Al Habsi, Augustyn.
Look at the line up for big sam's last game. Campo and Speed were finished. Michalik, meite, Thompson, tal, teymourian were all shit. Anelka wanted out. Big Sam left us with nothing. We had no young players to build the team around.
So was Big Sam's short term strategy to blame?

At least under Mugson we started signing young players with some talent - Cahill, Muamba, mark Davies, lee, etc. But then he blew loads on shit like Elmander, Sean Davis and Knight.

We should have brought back Colin Todd, he had an eye for a good signing!

but that team got into Europe.

the likes of Tal, Andranik, Michalik who were average all told got the usual bolton fans response "They're shit"

My personal feeling is that this club is capable of competing in the lower half of the Premier League but to do that it must produce some of its own players through the ranks and buy players from lower leagues in this country or abroad on short term contracts [2 years max] and not be signing expensive "proven" players on long contracts. At least this way if their attitude is right they should put the effort in and if they aren't up to it then you can move them on reasonably quickly and cheaply. Fans get to see some youngsters coming through which is always good and the club can make a profit if they attract the bigger clubs.

It means that if you get it wrong in any season then relegation is always on the horizon but it is a workable and affordable strategy. No one enjoys being relegated but if we were in the middle of a promotion campaign now no one would be moaning too much. The problems really started when survival wasn't good enough any more and money started to be chucked around.

Hipster_Nebula wrote:

the likes of Tal, Andranik, Michalik who were average all told got the usual bolton fans response "They're shit"

I'm sick of you taking this line, that every Bolton fan always thinks their players are shit. As though you're above that sort of thing.

This is the team from Boxing Day:

Bogdan
Mears
Ream
Knight
Ricketts
Eagles
Andrews
Petrov
Spearing
Ngog
Afobe
Used Subs:
Alonso
Sordell
Lee

Please go through it and mark each player with a Good, Average or Shit rating. I'll bet you get mainly "shit".