Coronavirus - will we survive?

wanderlust wrote:Really unnecessary snide comment yet again but yet again I’ll let it pass in case you have another hissy fit.

In answer to the question, I am a great believer in wearing masks and showing respect for others however the point I was making is that it is obligatory to wear a mask when entering catering premises regardless of the risk to social distancing and yet it’s ok to remove said mask once inside. Surely common sense would dictate that you should where a mask if people are near but it’s not necessary if they are ten yards away?

What's the hardship in doing so?

Some country's lockdowns include wearing a mask all the time - the Japanese seem to already be doing that even before the virus was even in existence!

As far as I'm concerned it's just something you do as a habit.

You made a point on one of your earlier posts about everyone wearing a mask indoors where you are - and yet you are quibbling about wearing one yourself when simply walking to your table in a restaurant in that country.

Make your mind up or are you simply saying it's a good thing for others to do it but you are some sort of special case and can do what you want, when you please?

It's about time the government stopped pussyfooting around and gave the British public an ultimatum. If cases are still increasing in 7 days time they should close all bars and restaurants and any other "entertainment" venue and put everyone back into lockdown.

People aren't taking this seriously. Make mask wearing mandatory outside the home with an instant 28 day prison sentence for anyone caught going without. Start fooking cracking down on these twats and give them something to think about.

Sluffy wrote:

What's the hardship in doing so?

Some country's lockdowns include wearing a mask all the time - the Japanese seem to already be doing that even before the virus was even in existence!

As far as I'm concerned it's just something you do as a habit.

You made a point on one of your earlier posts about everyone wearing a mask indoors where you are - and yet you are quibbling about wearing one yourself when simply walking to your table in a restaurant in that country.

Make your mind up or are you simply saying it's a good thing for others to do it but you are some sort of special case and can do what you want, when you please?

Erm ... no.
You’ve completely failed to grasp the point again.

Natasha Whittam wrote:It's about time the government stopped pussyfooting around and gave the British public an ultimatum. If cases are still increasing in 7 days time they should close all bars and restaurants and any other "entertainment" venue and put everyone back into lockdown.

People aren't taking this seriously. Make mask wearing mandatory outside the home with an instant 28 day prison sentence for anyone caught going without. Start fooking cracking down on these twats and give them something to think about.

Pretty much what’s happening in Spain and it will eventually work but it will take time as virus spread is a critical mass thing and once the cat is out of the bag it takes draconian measures to sort the problem.

Natasha Whittam wrote:It's about time the government stopped pussyfooting around and gave the British public an ultimatum. If cases are still increasing in 7 days time they should close all bars and restaurants and any other "entertainment" venue and put everyone back into lockdown.

People aren't taking this seriously. Make mask wearing mandatory outside the home with an instant 28 day prison sentence for anyone caught going without. Start fooking cracking down on these twats and give them something to think about.

Spot on there Tasha!

Agree with Nat people aren’t listening so the government need to get tough. I’ve been to France and Turkey over summer (one holiday, one not) - everywhere I went in both countries everyone wore masks in shops. In Turkey everyone wears a mask in restaurants until their food arrived. For whatever reason the advice here hasn’t been taken seriously enough, there seems to be a fundamental distrust in the government - that’s not a Tory thing it would be the same if it was Labour I’m sure.

I'm beginning to think the contrary, that maybe it is best just to let the virus spread and have done with it - but with one or two proviso's though.

And those are that as long as hospital admissions remain low (todays information is saying 124 new admissions, 756 in hospital, 69 on ventilation - compared to the 26th August - the last time I made a note for myself - of 97 admissions, 782 in hospital, 68 on vents - so no real change in two weeks even though there were 1,048 new cases that day and it as not been that low ever since) and deaths remain low - both of which they are!

My reason goes something like this.

You simply can't stop outbreaks happening - look at New Zealand for instance where they had no cases for weeks/months.  You also can not stop people doing what they please (you can't lock everyone up!), so even if we were to impose a massive lockdown, impose draconian sanctions and got the virus down to zero, it would only take one undetected illegal immigrant sneaking into the country with the virus, or one person illegally trafficked here with the virus, or somebody doing something dodgy and it all kicks off again!

Wouldn't it be better just to get it done and dusted now as it seems that the vast bulk of those testing positive are in general terms, quite healthy even though they have it, that the cases are not swamping the NHS and that deaths are in all honesty incredibly low.

There's some talk about herd immunity and if you had it once do you become immune to it (and if so for how long?) but IF the overwhelming number of positives lead to nothing more than a couple of weeks self isolation then why not let it spread?

OK we would have to shield the vulnerable but they would have to be shielded anyway as we go through the second, third, fourth waves etc?

The virus is in the community and in reality we either ALL lock ourselves away worldwide, until no one has it and its gone for good (or until some Chinaman eats another infected pangolin (allegedly), or we accept we have to go through it, build up some immunity to it and get on with our lives.

I'm not saying all this glibly as I'm one of those who would need to be shielded and probably at greater risk than most but isn't it better to go through it knowingly and plan to keep your head down for three, four five months or however long it takes, rather have to go through it when the inevitable second, third, fourth waves arrive - and they will you know.

Are people safer in New Zealand where very, very few have had the virus - but know it could spread like wildfire if some infected person started it off again - or say Bolton that's in the middle of it right now?

At least once Bolton comes out of it, a goodly percentage of the population would have had it and come through unscathed and unlikely to have it again, whereas in New Zealand they've had all those lockdowns, been scrupulous over keeping it out and still have had that outbreak and further lockdown.

If it's going to happen and you can't stop it then you might as well let it happen on your terms and that seems to me that many who were vulnerable to it have already died from it, hospitals seemed to have learned how best to treat most cases and the ones catching it aren't suffering from it - and they are the ones who will not abide by the rules (masks, social distancing, isolating themselves when required to, etc) and catch it sooner or later anyway?

A bit of a radical view from me I know but one that seems the most practical in the circumstances we find ourselves in I would suggest.

Norpig wrote:So many people on my facebook pages bragging they won't wear a mask, it's no wonder Bolton is top of the table 

What these morons don't seem to be able to grasp is that yes it may not affect therm if they get it but they could pass it on to their parents of grandparents who may have underlying issues which will only get worse if they catch it.

 Even more outrage on Facebook now the restrictions have tightened, people up in arms about their civil liberties and the conspiracy theories have ramped up again. 

Why does my hometown have to be full of thick as shit morons? Glad i moved away to be honest.

Seems the 'pub' story may well be true after all!

9:33
UK has seen issues with social distancing - Hancock

There have been problems with social distancing in the UK, according to the country's health secretary.

When asked if people were not following the rules, Matt Hancock told LBC: "We certainly see cases where they are not, and then we take action."

He said that many cases in Bolton were linked to a single pub which has been asked to close.

Hancock highlighted recent rises in cases in France, Spain and in some other countries across Europe.

"Nobody wants to see a second wave here," he said.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-54053588

Norpig wrote:

Norpig wrote:So many people on my facebook pages bragging they won't wear a mask, it's no wonder Bolton is top of the table 

What these morons don't seem to be able to grasp is that yes it may not affect therm if they get it but they could pass it on to their parents of grandparents who may have underlying issues which will only get worse if they catch it.

 Even more outrage on Facebook now the restrictions have tightened, people up in arms about their civil liberties and the conspiracy theories have ramped up again. 

Why does my hometown have to be full of thick as shit morons? Glad i moved away to be honest.

It's not FULL of them but I know what you mean.

Found this from 28th August - Breightmet pub as on Bury Road (near the bootom Bull) as well -

Bolton pub closed as customer tested positive for coronavirus




https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/18683532.pub-closed-clean-customer-tested-positive-coronavirus/

Sluffy wrote:Found this from 28th August - Breightmet pub as on Bury Road (near the bottom Bull) as well -

Bolton pub closed as customer tested positive for coronavirus




https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/18683532.pub-closed-clean-customer-tested-positive-coronavirus/

It's the Bottom Bull as mentioned further up.

This letter sums up what a lot of people are feeling here in Warrington.

https://www.warringtonguardian.co.uk/yoursay/letters/18698523.letter-i-really-dont-feel-safe-anywhere-warrington/

Natasha Whittam wrote:It's about time the government stopped pussyfooting around and gave the British public an ultimatum. If cases are still increasing in 7 days time they should close all bars and restaurants and any other "entertainment" venue and put everyone back into lockdown.

People aren't taking this seriously. Make mask wearing mandatory outside the home with an instant 28 day prison sentence for anyone caught going without. Start fooking cracking down on these twats and give them something to think about.

Across the pond, after a horrendous March and April, our rate of infection in New York is less than 1%.  Yet today, less than 75% wear masks, or wear them properly (with their nose covered).   Draconian state and city measures did work, especially when the federal government failed us time and time again.  Listen to the scientists... and Natasha... they both know how to mitigate the length of this pandemic.

boltonbonce wrote:This letter sums up what a lot of people are feeling here in Warrington.

https://www.warringtonguardian.co.uk/yoursay/letters/18698523.letter-i-really-dont-feel-safe-anywhere-warrington/

She's right but what can we do?

IF everybody did the simple stuff - social distance, stay in your bubble, etc - then the virus couldn't spread - but from what I've seen the majority (probably even the vast majority) simply don't - you even have people like Wanderlust who claims he has great concerns about catching it moaning on here as to having to wear a mask to enter a restaurant to get to his socially distance table ffs!

We have too many people who simply won't follow the 'rules' and they simple can't be enforced as such, which leaves us with two choices, we go back into a severe lockdown and put the army on to the streets to enforce it - which apart from being unacceptable to many would ruin the economy, or we soldier on the best we can how we are doing now - which although new cases are going through the roof, hasn't as yet translated that into people needing hospitalisation and deaths - so it seems the young are catching it in the main but it is not harming them.

So it makes sense, if for the economy's sake alone, to let life continue but with the consequence that the older and ill have to live in fear of catching it.

I can only speak for myself and have organised my life accordingly to minimise the risk to me.  For instance I do go out but at 'off-peak' times - I avoid crowds, I stay in the open as much as I can, I stay away from popular places and town centres, large stores, touristy places, etc, etc.

Maybe I'm fortunate enough to be able to do such things, I'm sure many aren't, but they would have to minimise the risks as much as they can in their own particular circumstance they find themselves in.

This thing isn't going away and clearly much of the population aren't really changing their lives much to do anything to help get rid of it so the only option I can see is those like myself have to be the ones who change our ways.

The world isn't going to change for me so I must be the one to change for the world.

What other choice is there?

'Just' another 45 new cases for Bolton today but a further 2,948 for the UK.

Reported numbers have 'usually' been a little lower on Sunday's and Monday's as information isn't always filed by some at the weekend and the totals are added to the Tuesdays and Wednesday's, so if that is the case this weekend it makes you wonder what the totals will be like in the next few days!

We'll soon find out though.

Sluffy wrote:

She's right but what can we do?

IF everybody did the simple stuff - social distance, stay in your bubble, etc - then the virus couldn't spread - but from what I've seen the majority (probably even the vast majority) simply don't - you even have people like Wanderlust who claims he has great concerns about catching it moaning on here as to having to wear a mask to enter a restaurant to get to his socially blah blah missed the point again diatribe 

Wtf is up with you? Do you fancy me or something?

wanderlust wrote:

Sluffy wrote:

She's right but what can we do?

IF everybody did the simple stuff - social distance, stay in your bubble, etc - then the virus couldn't spread - but from what I've seen the majority (probably even the vast majority) simply don't - you even have people like Wanderlust who claims he has great concerns about catching it moaning on here as to having to wear a mask to enter a restaurant to get to his socially blah blah missed the point again diatribe 

Wtf is up with you? Do you fancy me or something?

If your looks are anything like the way you portray and present yourself on here then most certainly not.

I don't appreciate you rewriting my quotes either to put your words in to my mouth.

I didn't miss the point at all, you clearly thought it was pointless wearing a mask in the circumstances you described - the alternative being the diners somehow consume their food whilst still wearing their masks!

However that proved the point I was making namely that the majority of people simply can't just accept the current conventions required of them to beat the virus but instead determine themselves what they believe/think/feel they are entitled to do instead - and go ahead and do so, and don't give a fuck about anyone else.

Is it any wonder why new infections are shooting upwards again with attitudes and behaviour like that?

All pubs, bars and restaurants are now takeaway only in Bolton under new lockdown measures...

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/18705319.coronavirus-pubs-bars-restaurants-bolton-restricted-takeaway-new-lockdown-measures/

You just couldn't make it up!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8708875/Merseyside-beauty-salon-slammed-putting-poster-denying-coronavirus-exists.html