Former Whites?

We played Fleetwood Town and faced former fans favourite Josh Vela as well as Jay Lynch. There was a third, but I can't recall his name now - maybe one of you can enlighten me. That said, I always liked Vela - and Dixon doesn't inspire my confidence. Do you think Vela or Lynch could make the current squad? Any realistic former Wanderers you would like to see make a return?

Keegan wrote:We played Fleetwood Town and faced former fans favourite Josh Vela as well as Jay Lynch. There was a third, but I can't recall his name now - maybe one of you can enlighten me. That said, I always liked Vela - and Dixon doesn't inspire my confidence. Do you think Vela or Lynch could make the current squad? Any realistic former Wanderers you would like to see make a return?

Tote Nsiala was the third one - he was one of those we had never heard of before, signed under Keith Hill's management.

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No none of the three would be good enough to get into our current side imo - Traf is clearly better than Lynch, Toal better than Nsiala and Dempsey and Morley better than Vela in the system we play.

I guess you could put a case for Vela as a better player than MJ Williams as a defensive midfielder but I've never liked Vela's attitude off the pitch - his tweets against Freedman and his pisshead antics with Wheater - so I would still prefer Williams professionalism to Vela's 'disruption' - note how he left his last club to join Fleetwood for instance...

Vela agreed to a new contract of undisclosed length with the club at the end of the 2021–22 season.[37] It was later revealed however that despite having agreed terms with the club, Vela would indeed be departing the club upon the expiration of his contract.

As for the player I would realistically have back, then the obvious choice is Dapo.

Cheers - Nsiala was one from the dark ages so I forgot him. Traf is better than Lynch, but he isn't ours - is Lynch better than Dixon? I imagine he is! I had no issue with Vela and his pisshead antics off the pitch, my concern is performance on it. Doyle and Izzy both give pisshead vibes and they did the business for us. I think the less said about Freedman, the better - Vela had a better view of him than most so I won't fault him for anything he said about him!

If not having a professional attitude about yourself outside of your work is not an issue to you, then fair enough.

I've always believed otherwise.

People are born with whatever talent they have and it is up to them to make the best of it - or not.

If they aren't bothered enough to show respect to others (public tweets about the club manager) or themselves (getting pissed, doing drugs perhaps, chasing skirt, etc, etc,) then that's up to them - but sooner or later it will catch up to them - and ultimately effect the talent they had.

There's many examples - George Best, Gazza, Ravel Morrison, to name just three - all had world class talent, all who ended up self-destructing themselves.

Would Vela, Doyle and Izzy have had better careers if they looked after themselves more than they did - none of them established themselves at Championship level - and I suggest they all could have done with more self discipline and a professional outlook on life.

Their life's, their choices, but if I was a manager and given a choice between two players with the same talents, I'd choose the one who took their careers seriously and worked on being the best they can be - and not the ones who you can't always depend on.

You only have to look at the transformation of Arsenal and Manchester United under their current Managers this season, who have kicked out the 'trouble makers' at their respective clubs over the last season and at half - and see how better the results have suddenly become.

It isn't a coincidence that teams play better when you aren't having to accommodate people with the wrong attitudes.

Haha, I didn't know Vela did drugs (why mention drugs if he didn't?) - but I happen to know Ravel Morrison (who is a Reggae Boy) was diagnosed with ADHD and the drugs that would have helped his condition were not allowed in football - so he had to choose between playing football with a "bad attitude" and having a good attitude and not playing. Based on what you have said, your managerial career would have bypassed the mercurial talents of Diego Maradona and Ronaldinho. If you prefer workhorses to flair and talent, then so be it.

Keegan wrote:Haha, I didn't know Vela did drugs (why mention drugs if he didn't?) - but I happen to know Ravel Morrison (who is a Reggae Boy) was diagnosed with ADHD and the drugs that would have helped his condition were not allowed in football - so he had to choose between playing football with a "bad attitude" and having a good attitude and not playing. Based on what you have said, your managerial career would have bypassed the mercurial talents of Diego Maradona and Ronaldinho. If you prefer workhorses to flair and talent, then so be it.

I didn't say Vela was on drugs, I was stating that there are two components to life, what skills you are born with and the attitude you have to make the most of them, and yourself.

It's your choice what you do in life but you tend to achieve more with your natural abilities if you have the right attitude and mentality to make the most of what gifts you are born with.

I don't believe for one second that Morrison is the only player to have ADHD and I've not heard of any of them who are or have been, professional footballers having issues over any medication they may have to take for it.

I'm sure that would apply to any other sport covered by drug taking controls.

Morrison is quite clearly a nasty piece of work as per his legal history and I doubt even he can blame all his issues simply on ADHD.

You may be interested in this article...

Excelling with a Player that Has ADHD

Sports, in this case soccer, should be a part of every kid’s life, and there is no reason for an player with ADHD should not be able to enjoy and succeed in soccer at a higher level.

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And for the players you name above, talent may well get you to the top of the game but only the right attitude and hard work keeps you there.

Ronaldo, Beckham, Modric, and a whole host of world class players have long and distinguished careers due to their attitude to be the best they can be - so no I never said I prefer workhorse to flair and talent, what I said was that you also need the right attitude to make the most of your talent, otherwise just like Maradona, Ronaldinho and Morrison you ultimately self destruct and cut your own career far too short than what it could have been.

Vela was a decent player but he's never fulfilled his potential. When he first came in he looked like a player who could play at the highest level but he seemed to coast along and was always on the piss with Wheater apparently.

His only contribution on Saturday was a nasty tackle, other than that he had no real say on the game.

Remember this chap? I remember him going to India then heard nothing about him till i read this.

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Sluffy wrote:If not having a professional attitude about yourself outside of your work is not an issue to you, then fair enough.

I've always believed otherwise.

People are born with whatever talent they have and it is up to them to make the best of it - or not.

If they aren't bothered enough to show respect to others (public tweets about the club manager) or themselves (getting pissed, doing drugs perhaps, chasing skirt, etc, etc,) then that's up to them - but sooner or later it will catch up to them - and ultimately effect the talent they had.

There's many examples - George Best, Gazza, Ravel Morrison, to name just three - all had world class talent, all who ended up self-destructing themselves.

Would Vela, Doyle and Izzy have had better careers if they looked after themselves more than they did - none of them established themselves at Championship level - and I suggest they all could have done with more self discipline and a professional outlook on life.

Their life's, their choices, but if I was a manager and given a choice between two players with the same talents, I'd choose the one who took their careers seriously and worked on being the best they can be - and not the ones who you can't always depend on.

You only have to look at the transformation of Arsenal and Manchester United under their current Managers this season, who have kicked out the 'trouble makers' at their respective clubs over the last season and at half - and see how better the results have suddenly become.

It isn't a coincidence that teams play better when you aren't having to accommodate people with the wrong attitudes.

Totally agree Sluffy, it’s what people have between the ears that makes the difference in sport as in all walks of life. Many players make it to the top but very few stay there. World class sportspeople like those you name plus the likes of Rod Laver, Federer in tennis, Ali in boxing and Player and Nicklaus in golf stayed at the top because they were mentally strong and also realised they had to sacrifice their way of life to stay there. Nicklaus for example went back to his old coach Jack Grout every year before the season started to re-learn the key areas, grip, stance and takeaway. 

Too many think once they get there they’ve made it and they don’t have to work hard any more and to be fair with the amount of money they earn today they can afford to do that but they’ll never be considered greats. Only those who are committed to their sport and prepared to continue to put in the hard yards become legends and these days they are few and far between I’m afraid.