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So much for parliamentary democracy

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31So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 08:46

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Bad defeat for Boris and Cummings last night, is he really surprised nobody trusts him enough to believe that this is a negotiating position though? He’s made his own bed with so many mistruths, little wonder he can’t get the backing of any but the nuts of his party.

A front bench including Rees Mogg and Nadine Dorries really tells you everything you need to know, these nutters won’t be around long.

32So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 08:55

bryan458

bryan458
Tony Kelly
Tony Kelly

33So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 10:43

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Bring on the election.

34So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 10:50

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@T.R.O.Y wrote:Bad defeat for Boris and Cummings last night, is he really surprised nobody trusts him enough to believe that this is a negotiating position though? He’s made his own bed with so many mistruths, little wonder he can’t get the backing of any but the nuts of his party.


Don't you think Boris knew exactly what he was doing?

35So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 13:16

wessy

wessy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
One things for certain Boris is desperate now for an election, without it he has backed himself into a corner, if he doesn't honour the leave on the 31st he is toast.

 If Labour have any sense they won't fall into the trap and allow an election before the deadline. Let the arrogant man hang himself when he fails.  

After PMQ's the Chancellor stood up to give his spending review(bribe for election) he didn't know the bloody procedure pulled up twice by the speaker what a plonker.

36So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 13:26

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Bercow is a jumped up little tosser that needs a good smacking.

37So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 13:27

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@wessy wrote:One things for certain Boris is desperate now for an election, without it he has backed himself into a corner, if he doesn't honour the leave on the 31st he is toast.

 If Labour have any sense they won't fall into the trap and allow an election before the deadline. Let the arrogant man hang himself when he fails.  

After PMQ's the Chancellor stood up to give his spending review(bribe for election) he didn't know the bloody procedure pulled up twice by the speaker what a plonker.

I think everything is going to Boris Johnson's plan.

He'll walk an election.

38So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 13:28

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Natasha Whittam wrote:
@wessy wrote:One things for certain Boris is desperate now for an election, without it he has backed himself into a corner, if he doesn't honour the leave on the 31st he is toast.

 If Labour have any sense they won't fall into the trap and allow an election before the deadline. Let the arrogant man hang himself when he fails.  

After PMQ's the Chancellor stood up to give his spending review(bribe for election) he didn't know the bloody procedure pulled up twice by the speaker what a plonker.

I think everything is going to Boris Johnson's plan.

He'll walk an election.

I can't wait. He needs to drain the swap!

39So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 14:27

okocha

okocha
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Natasha Whittam wrote:


Don't you think Boris knew exactly what he was doing?


Yes indeed, here's a photo of a man whose expression after heavy defeat last night proves he knew exactly what he and his fellow bullies/liars were doing and certainly not been rumbled for the charlatan he is   Razz Very Happy

So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 GetAttachmentThumbnail?id=AQMkADAwATYwMAItODc0Zi1iMDk1LTAwAi0wMAoARgAAA5DmPtLwnUtPjqT0%2BWBpCKsHAAXOZEdA065Nm4RS010myPoAAAIBCQAAAAXOZEdA065Nm4RS010myPoAA6CdRR8AAAABEgAQANp0dACA60qRRLoqkEqUgUKx&thumbnailType=2&owa=outlook.live.com&scriptVer=2019082310.13&isc=1&X-OWA-CANARY=vCH2jr5Rk0K9m_g0_UXwWMCqeY86MdcYzcjcO4sQFC3Y4_sTLVv8OuRamwVCY1nvOHAruubVy40.&token=eyJhbGciOiJSUzI1NiIsImtpZCI6IjA2MDBGOUY2NzQ2MjA3MzdFNzM0MDRFMjg3QzQ1QTgxOENCN0NFQjgiLCJ4NXQiOiJCZ0Q1OW5SaUJ6Zm5OQVRpaDhSYWdZeTN6cmciLCJ0eXAiOiJKV1QifQ.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

40So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 14:29

okocha

okocha
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@karlypants wrote:Bercow is a jumped up little tosser that needs a good smacking.

He speaks well of you, though

41So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 15:00

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
The epitome of arrogance, sprawled across the Tory benches.


So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 P07mdnwd

42So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 15:49

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
Bonce, you're telling me that you've never had a lie down at work?

43So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 17:08

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@Natasha Whittam wrote:Bonce, you're telling me that you've never had a lie down at work?
Never. Difficult working outdoors, but I will admit to buying an ice lolly on a hot day.

44So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 17:15

okocha

okocha
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
"No deal Brexit will be great for business,"  says the undertaker....

So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 69499458_3251515934888677_6422065324111167488_n.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_oc=AQnoJfZGCvoSOZLRQUIWyNVDyry1cdp2o3O19y1TbLuXxJ-5BCJG0WR0LqHLkG1e6d0&_nc_ht=scontent-lht6-1

45So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 17:25

Natasha Whittam

Natasha Whittam
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@boltonbonce wrote:Never.

What about all those times you left work on a stretcher?

46So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 17:58

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@boltonbonce wrote:The epitome of arrogance, sprawled across the Tory benches.


So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 P07mdnwd

Corbyn was slumped down in his chair yesterday also. 

Not mentioned once in the media.

47So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 18:10

wessy

wessy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Hipster_Nebula wrote:
@boltonbonce wrote:The epitome of arrogance, sprawled across the Tory benches.


So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 P07mdnwd

Corbyn was slumped down in his chair yesterday also. 

Not mentioned once in the media.
Clutching at straws Hipster

48So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 18:14

wessy

wessy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@karlypants wrote:Bercow is a jumped up little tosser that needs a good smacking.
Well yes he is a Tory after all !! BUT He does know the rules and procedure unlike both the PM and Chancellor who broke protocol.

49So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 18:19

wessy

wessy
Andy Walker
Andy Walker
@Natasha Whittam wrote:
@wessy wrote:One things for certain Boris is desperate now for an election, without it he has backed himself into a corner, if he doesn't honour the leave on the 31st he is toast.

 If Labour have any sense they won't fall into the trap and allow an election before the deadline. Let the arrogant man hang himself when he fails.  

After PMQ's the Chancellor stood up to give his spending review(bribe for election) he didn't know the bloody procedure pulled up twice by the speaker what a plonker.

I think everything is going to Boris Johnson's plan.

He'll walk an election.
Explain his plan? six weeks into the job and loses his majority, he is a wounded animal, that makes him dangerous but he ain't got a plan that will work.

 No Election before deadline = No Boris unless of course he changes all the rules and sacks a few more of his own side. His behaviour so far is not really making him electable. He will lose seats in Scotland, He loses 21 faithful blues by is own hand. Looks like another hung parliament at best.

50So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 19:51

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@wessy wrote:
@Natasha Whittam wrote:
@wessy wrote:One things for certain Boris is desperate now for an election, without it he has backed himself into a corner, if he doesn't honour the leave on the 31st he is toast.

 If Labour have any sense they won't fall into the trap and allow an election before the deadline. Let the arrogant man hang himself when he fails.  

After PMQ's the Chancellor stood up to give his spending review(bribe for election) he didn't know the bloody procedure pulled up twice by the speaker what a plonker.

I think everything is going to Boris Johnson's plan.

He'll walk an election.
Explain his plan? six weeks into the job and loses his majority, he is a wounded animal, that makes him dangerous but he ain't got a plan that will work.

 No Election before deadline = No Boris unless of course he changes all the rules and sacks a few more of his own side. His behaviour so far is not really making him electable. He will lose seats in Scotland, He loses 21 faithful blues by is own hand. Looks like another hung parliament at best.

Plan is to strengthen his hand by having a big majority.

He could not do anything with such a tiny majority that May had left him with so he knew he was never going to achieve Brexit by October.

He knows that the EU don't believe we will ever go for a NO Deal Brexit - but also know IF we did it would cause pain on their side also.

There's no chance of them renegotiating when they know it isn't an option as things stand.

Johnson knows that by having a General Election and entering into a pact with the Brexit Party, as well as deselecting the Tory rebels (who will not all retain their seats if they stood as independents, that he will win comfortably.  Tory Brexit candidates will stand in the rebel 21 seats and win most/all of them.

The Brexit party will target Labour seats who voted for Brexit in the referendum (and recent European election) and the Tories will not contest them.

Similarly the Brexit Party will not stand against Tory seats.

Between them they will smash Labour under Corbyn - and that's why Corbyn won't back a GE unless a referendum is called first.

If there is a referendum and the people vote Brexit again, then there's not much point in the Brexit Party standing against them in the GE as Labour will be forced to support Brexit now (Corbyn always had anyway).  If the vote is Remain, then Labour is in a winning position and the vote sinks the whole Brexit debate (for now anyway).

Johnson will win big out of a GE and Labour be put to the sword by the Brexit Party outside of London, Wales and Scotland.

Conservatives plus Brexit Party seats will give a huge mandate for Brexit - even No Deal Brexit - and will force the EU to offer better terms.

That's the game that is being played I believe.

51So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 20:43

Angry Dad

Angry Dad
Youri Djorkaeff
Youri Djorkaeff
@Sluffy wrote:
@wessy wrote:
@Natasha Whittam wrote:
@wessy wrote:One things for certain Boris is desperate now for an election, without it he has backed himself into a corner, if he doesn't honour the leave on the 31st he is toast.

 If Labour have any sense they won't fall into the trap and allow an election before the deadline. Let the arrogant man hang himself when he fails.  

After PMQ's the Chancellor stood up to give his spending review(bribe for election) he didn't know the bloody procedure pulled up twice by the speaker what a plonker.

I think everything is going to Boris Johnson's plan.

He'll walk an election.
Explain his plan? six weeks into the job and loses his majority, he is a wounded animal, that makes him dangerous but he ain't got a plan that will work.

 No Election before deadline = No Boris unless of course he changes all the rules and sacks a few more of his own side. His behaviour so far is not really making him electable. He will lose seats in Scotland, He loses 21 faithful blues by is own hand. Looks like another hung parliament at best.

Plan is to strengthen his hand by having a big majority.

He could not do anything with such a tiny majority that May had left him with so he knew he was never going to achieve Brexit by October.

He knows that the EU don't believe we will ever go for a NO Deal Brexit - but also know IF we did it would cause pain on their side also.

There's no chance of them renegotiating when they know it isn't an option as things stand.

Johnson knows that by having a General Election and entering into a pact with the Brexit Party, as well as deselecting the Tory rebels (who will not all retain their seats if they stood as independents, that he will win comfortably.  Tory Brexit candidates will stand in the rebel 21 seats and win most/all of them.

The Brexit party will target Labour seats who voted for Brexit in the referendum (and recent European election) and the Tories will not contest them.

Similarly the Brexit Party will not stand against Tory seats.

Between them they will smash Labour under Corbyn - and that's why Corbyn won't back a GE unless a referendum is called first.

If there is a referendum and the people vote Brexit again, then there's not much point in the Brexit Party standing against them in the GE as Labour will be forced to support Brexit now (Corbyn always had anyway).  If the vote is Remain, then Labour is in a winning position and the vote sinks the whole Brexit debate (for now anyway).

Johnson will win big out of a GE and Labour be put to the sword by the Brexit Party outside of London, Wales and Scotland.

Conservatives plus Brexit Party seats will give a huge mandate for Brexit - even No Deal Brexit - and will force the EU to offer better terms.

That's the game that is being played I believe.
Sure is.

52So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 20:47

Angry Dad

Angry Dad
Youri Djorkaeff
Youri Djorkaeff
Taking candy from a baby, these labour lot are pretty much Stupid, can they not see it coming.

53So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 20:49

finlaymcdanger

finlaymcdanger
El Hadji Diouf
El Hadji Diouf
So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Img_6710

54So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 20:54

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
So no deal’s off the table now, meaning Boris’s master plan of crashing out without a deal has been scuppered.

So a general election will come down to if Labour can convince enough centrists that it’s plan on Brexit is achievable. Id happily take a Labour Lib Dem/SNP coalition if necessary.

It should be remembered that Labour were much further behind in the polls for the last GE and almost took it, plus Boris is far more divisive than May was for soft conservatives. All to play for so to speak.

55So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 21:05

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@Angry Dad wrote:Taking candy from a baby, these labour lot are pretty much Stupid, can they not see it coming.

Yes they can and that's why they are so desperate to have a second referendum before having the GE.

A normal Labour Party would have been pro EU/Remain all along.

The loonies in control with Corbyn as the leader have mismanaged Brexit all along, hoping to see the Tories destruct following on from Brexit and them staying in power because of it for the next three GE's at least.

Bad, bad, bad miscalculation as well as putting achieving of being in power themselves before the good of the country.

56So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 21:09

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin
@T.R.O.Y wrote:So no deal’s off the table now, meaning Boris’s master plan of crashing out without a deal has been scuppered.

So a general election will come down to if Labour can convince enough centrists that it’s plan on Brexit is achievable. Id happily take a Labour Lib Dem/SNP coalition if necessary.

It should be remembered that Labour were much further behind in the polls for the last GE and almost took it, plus Boris is far more divisive than May was for soft conservatives. All to play for so to speak.

The Brexit Party has been established since then.

Game changer.

Labour will lose mass seats against them outside London, Wales and Scotland.


57So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 21:25

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
The Brexit party are a flash in the pan. A general election would put the many nut jobs that'll be standing on their particular ticket, under serious media scrutiny, a scrutiny they didn't get at the European election.
It won't be a pretty sight.

58So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 21:30

T.R.O.Y


Andy Walker
Andy Walker
Agree with you Bonce, especially as May has now gone they'll struggle to take the votes they did from the Tories. Boris will attract all the hard right nutters, the challenge for the centre and left (as always) is not being split in too many directions.

It will be a close run thing, but a right wing Tory party propped up by any seats the Brexit party can win plus the DUP doesn’t bear thinking about.

59So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 21:39

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@wessy wrote:
@Hipster_Nebula wrote:
@boltonbonce wrote:The epitome of arrogance, sprawled across the Tory benches.


So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 P07mdnwd

Corbyn was slumped down in his chair yesterday also. 

Not mentioned once in the media.
Clutching at straws Hipster

No just pointing out that mogg isn't the only one in parliament who doesn't sit up straight.

60So much for parliamentary democracy - Page 2 Empty Re: So much for parliamentary democracy on Wed Sep 04 2019, 21:40

Hipster_Nebula

Hipster_Nebula
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse
@T.R.O.Y wrote:So no deal’s off the table now, meaning Boris’s master plan of crashing out without a deal has been scuppered.

So a general election will come down to if Labour can convince enough centrists that it’s plan on Brexit is achievable. Id happily take a Labour Lib Dem/SNP coalition if necessary.

It should be remembered that Labour were much further behind in the polls for the last GE and almost took it, plus Boris is far more divisive than May was for soft conservatives. All to play for so to speak.

Labours plan is to negotiate a deal to leave and then campaign against it. Absolutely laughable. 

If they had any sense they'd come out as a party who wish to revoke article 50 and cut the lib Dems off at the knees.

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