Coronavirus - will we survive?

wanderlust wrote:Vaccine trials have hit a problem. Trump's big hope ("we'll have a vaccine in place before the election") Johnson and Johnson, have suspended trials after a participant in the study developed an unknown neurological illness. AstraZeneca's trial has also been suspended since September due to similar problems.

Astra Zeneca's trial restarted a month ago -

Coronavirus: Oxford University to resume vaccine trial after pause

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54132066

Sluffy wrote:

Astra Zeneca's trial restarted a month ago -

Coronavirus: Oxford University to resume vaccine trial after pause

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54132066

Hadn't noticed it restarted yesterday and TBH I'm surprised they did after a second participant had neurological problems.

It's just been confirmed that a 25 year old bloke in Nevada has become the first person on record to catch Covid twice.

So either the antibodies don't work or the virus is mutating rapidly.

wanderlust wrote:It's just been confirmed that a 25 year old bloke in Nevada has become the first person on record to catch Covid twice.

So either the antibodies don't work or the virus is mutating rapidly.

Been reading social media again I see.

What you have written is not true.

"So far, reinfection seems to be rare - there have been only a few examples out of more than 37 million confirmed cases.

Reports in Hong Kong, Belgium and the Netherlands said they were no more serious than the first. One in Ecuador mirrored the US case in being more severe, but did not need hospital treatment.

However, it is still early into the pandemic, and the history of other types of coronavirus means protection is expected to wane".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54512034

And if you look on this link to...

Posted at 7:32
Covid-19 reinfection

...you will find an audio interview explaining what has happened and why.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/coronavirus

Here's a great article  about Covid mutation.

Discusses identified Covid mutations to date, similarities with the original, speculates on future mutations, explains how mutations affect vaccine development, how long immunity is likely to last etc.

Sort of reassuring but there are a lot of variables in there

Sluffy wrote:

Been reading social media again I see.

What you have written is not true.

"So far, reinfection seems to be rare - there have been only a few examples out of more than 37 million confirmed cases.

Reports in Hong Kong, Belgium and the Netherlands said they were no more serious than the first. One in Ecuador mirrored the US case in being more severe, but did not need hospital treatment.

However, it is still early into the pandemic, and the history of other types of coronavirus means protection is expected to wane".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54512034

And if you look on this link to...

Posted at 7:32
Covid-19 reinfection

...you will find an audio interview explaining what has happened and why.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/coronavirus

https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/13/europe/covid-19-dutch-woman-reinfection-death-intl/index.html

An unfortunate case today of reinfection.

Listening to the Parliamentary debate today it seems like both sides have missed the point.
Boris wants to have a locally targeted solution, but the Tier 3 measures are inadequate and unenforceable whereas Sir Keir wants a national lockdown which would be detrimental to the economy in areas that don't need a lockdown.

Its sad to see two mediocre politicians trying to score points from each other, and in the middle of a pandemic.

gloswhite wrote:Its sad to see two mediocre politicians trying to score points from each other, and in the middle of a pandemic.

Agreed but I do think the onus is on the Government to stop faffing about, come up with a coherent strategy and communicate it properly as there will be no satisfactory answer until they do. Sure Starmer can come up with questions and suggestions but ultimately he can't do anything about the situation - Boris can.
Too many people are ignoring the advice and that's largely because it's flaky advice that seems to discriminate arbitrarily e.g. why Liverpool?
If the guidance said "in areas where there are x number of new cases per y people over z amount of time, you will have to do a, b and c" then people in that area would understand it - and they may even self-regulate better if they knew their area was approaching a key milestone.
That said, to announce the daily/weekly figures in any area it would require a proper testing system such as they have elsewhere in the world.

The other aspect that is sadly lacking is any provision of enforcement capability which would be required mainly at the start until folk get the hang of it and realise their are consequences. Use the army to detain miscreants if necessary. Again folk would be far more inclined to self-regulate once they get it. Where communities play the game they will thrive.
Those simple provisions are surely not beyond the wit of the government and the cost would be more than offset by the economic benefits to the country.

Moreover the message would change from "we are doing this arbitrarily to you" to "it's up to you, people of Britain, to play the game and help ensure that others in your community do also - if you do you'll benefit"

Agree with every bit of that Wander. Apparently Boris has always been a libertarian, and doesn't want to deprive people of their own free will. Now is not the time to be everybody's friend, its not working. We could do with somebody with a backbone right now.

I was going to say like Maggie, then thought XM would throw a wobbly, and then I thought to myself, where's XM ?

gloswhite wrote:
I was going to say like Maggie,

Don't you start swearing at me....she sold us down the river and here we are at the coast...... 

gloswhite wrote:Agree with every bit of that Wander. Apparently Boris has always been a libertarian, and doesn't want to deprive people of their own free will. Now is not the time to be everybody's friend, its not working. We could do with somebody with a backbone right now.

I was going to say like Maggie, then thought XM would throw a wobbly, and then I thought to myself, where's XM ?

No need for backbone, just a PM with something between his ears would be a start.

Boris is in a bad position due to his own doing.  They have been banging on about following the science like some sort of comfort blanket, then when it comes to the second wave and tough economic decisions, they blatantly dump the advice, that's fine and in their gift but they have to own the consequences.

Starmer by coming out for the circuit breaker is saying that he is following the science, We know that delay had a serious repercussion on the numbers in March, so it follows the same applies now , Boris in taking the decision to go for regional lockdowns has now in terms of the science wasted three weeks.

 He now can't be seen to change tack to soon so he will delay further whilst his tier plan unfolds.

If by then the numbers are out of control and if he needs to bring in a circuit breaker he will be seen once again to have got it wrong and be responsible for x number of deaths. For me Starmer played a pretty good move in terms of out manouvering the PM.

I saw it as political point scoring. The "circuit breaker" is an absolute nonsense, it will make a minor difference if at all.

The government has got into difficulty because it's been way too soft from the start, but the reason this virus has got out of control in this country is because of the British people and their mentality.

Blame the government all you like, but people aren't following the rules. If we all followed the rules and made those sacrifices the virus would be in retreat, but instead we've got a large percentage of twats who think the rules don't apply to them.

Yes, the government has been poor, but the British people have been much, much worse. An absolute embarrassment in fact.

Natasha Whittam wrote:I saw it as political point scoring. The "circuit breaker" is an absolute nonsense, it will make a minor difference if at all.

The government has got into difficulty because it's been way too soft from the start, but the reason this virus has got out of control in this country is because of the British people and their mentality.

Blame the government all you like, but people aren't following the rules. If we all followed the rules and made those sacrifices the virus would be in retreat, but instead we've got a large percentage of twats who think the rules don't apply to them.

Yes, the government has been poor, but the British people have been much, much worse. An absolute embarrassment in fact.

We need Natasha to take on Bozo the Clown... I mean Trump!  Her last paragraph applies across the pond as well.

Natasha Whittam wrote:I saw it as political point scoring. The "circuit breaker" is an absolute nonsense, it will make a minor difference if at all.

The government has got into difficulty because it's been way too soft from the start, but the reason this virus has got out of control in this country is because of the British people and their mentality.

Blame the government all you like, but people aren't following the rules. If we all followed the rules and made those sacrifices the virus would be in retreat, but instead we've got a large percentage of twats who think the rules don't apply to them.

Yes, the government has been poor, but the British people have been much, much worse. An absolute embarrassment in fact.

But if the virus is out of control then surely we need a circuit breaker period?

I agree that we as a nation don't help ourselves so to my mind the circuit breaker is needed and tougher penalties need to be imposed on people who won't follow the rules.

Norpig wrote:But if the virus is out of control then surely we need a circuit breaker period?

I agree that we as a nation don't help ourselves so to my mind the circuit breaker is needed and tougher penalties need to be imposed on people who won't follow the rules.

A two week circuit breaker will achieve very little. It took a 3 month lockdown to get it under control earlier in the year.

Don't worry, I don't class you as one of the twats, I know Mrs Pig has insisted you wear a mask in public for years.

Natasha Whittam wrote:

A two week circuit breaker will achieve very little. It took a 3 month lockdown to get it under control earlier in the year.

Don't worry, I don't class you as one of the twats, I know Mrs Pig has insisted you wear a mask in public for years.

it's worse than that

You're slimmer than I imagined.