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Donald Trump for President of the USA

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wessy
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Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

This seems to be a big 'Trump' issue at the moment...

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

boltonbonce wrote:
I think we can take it that he’s not Donald’s biggest fan but his point on NATO members not paying their agreed share for protection when the US significantly over pays is spurious to say the least. Donald is the only one to call these countries out and has every right to do so even if sometimes his methods are less than political.

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Whitesince63 wrote:
I think we can take it that he’s not Donald’s biggest fan but his point on NATO members not paying their agreed share for protection when the US significantly over pays is spurious to say the least. Donald is the only one to call these countries out and has every right to do so even if sometimes his methods are less than political.
I assume you're  fine on him encouraging Russia to attack us?

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

Whitesince63 wrote:I think we can take it that he’s not Donald’s biggest fan but his point on NATO members not paying their agreed share for protection when the US significantly over pays is spurious to say the least. Donald is the only one to call these countries out and has every right to do so even if sometimes his methods are less than political.

Oh God, every time I think you can't get anymore bonkers you post something like this and prove me wrong yet again.

NATO is the core basis of the western world's defence - to undermine it as he has emboldens crazies like Putin to attack.

Trump decided to withdraw US involvement from the middle east and it led directly to Russia filling the vacuum there.

Russia now has the sphere of influence with Syria, Iran, and the UAE that it never had before - Iran and the UAE are major players in avoiding sanctions and directly helping Russia in its war with Ukraine.

Trump unilaterally decided for HIS political reasons to bring home the troops from Afghanistan (and although the withdrawal to Trumps deadline took place under Biden) look at the tragedy for that country at what has since happened.

Trump has singlehandedly stopped the funding of arms to Ukraine and Ukraine are basically out of ammunition to defend themselves and consequently are in a bad way until something happens soon.

If Russia believes the USA won't help out if they attack Europe - then he will in the future attack it - initially the Baltic states which Putin believes like Ukraine is a part of Russia anyway!

Poland also in past history has been part of Russia and if he attacked them, then WE would be drawn into a war with Russia.

Do you believe that will never happen?

Well I believed a ground war in Europe would be unthinkable in this day and age  - but it is happening right now in Ukraine.


If Russia attacks and the USA does nothing where it is strongest (Europe), what do you think China might do in respect of Taiwan where logistically and geographically the USA is much weaker?

Ultimately who will protect western countries in that region such as Japan and Australia?

If the USA under Trump decides to become isolated from the rest of the world then it will effect the whole equilibrium of power across the globe.

These are not good things to happen.

Fwiw

Figure 4: NATO countries’ defence expenditure as a percentage of GDP (2015 prices), 2021

Donald Trump for President of the USA - Page 26 4
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/international-defence-expenditure-2022/finance-and-economics-annual-statistical-bulletin-international-defence-2022#nato-countries-defence-expenditure-as-a-percentage-of-gdp

NOTE - I'm pretty sure Germany in particular a few other countries have significantly stepped up their defence spending since Russia invaded Ukraine,


W63 you are likeable but you really, really are crazy if you believe in the guff you do - and unfortunately many in America clearly do to.

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Thanks Sluffy. Excellent post. Let's see if 63 can take it on board.

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

Thanks Bonce.

W63 you also have to comprehend what you are saying, let me try to explain.

On the face of what you said above (and based no doubt on what you read on the social media you follow and believe to be true) seems to have an element of sense to it - ie if someone isn't paying for a service then why should they expect to receive it.

A deeper question should be why aren't certain countries NOT paying the required amount and some are?

Well a deeper understanding comes from looking at the countries who ARE paying their full whack and more.

Not surprisingly the USA and UK ARE doing so but if you look at the others who do (or all but doing so) in the table above, you will note that Poland and ALL the Baltic states are.  Norway and Slovakia are also pretty high up on the list too, closely followed by Romania and Hungry

All these countries are bordering Russia and or Belarus and Ukraine.

Nearly all of the rest not paying full whack are countries much further away from Russia, Ukraine and Belarus.

In simple terms the countries who know and are threatened by Russia are only to keen to contribute for their security, the countries much further away, Portugal, Spain, etc, simply don't believe there is an chance of another war (I didn't too) and skimp on their contributions to pay for something more politically better for them in their own countries to keep the ruling political parties in power.

Germany basically got into bed with Russia, Christ one of their Chancellors, Gerhard Schröder, even left office to basically take charge of Russia's gas industry after him authorising billion of German investment involvement with the Nord Stream gas pipelines.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_Schr%C3%B6der#Views_and_controversies

In Janet and John terms, some countries understood how Russia thinks and behaves - it doesn't conform to how WE we understand things should be and do - and they've been proved right.

Countries in particular Germany and France (and we, Cameron with China) have misread them and not understood how they view the world and how unfettered they would act given the chance.

America under Trump has allowed Putin to act by thinking the west would take no action if he invaded Ukraine and it IS notable that although the US, UK and the countries who 'fear' Russia jumped in to help straight away - Germany, France and the EU simply DID NOT!

Germany belatedly has only recently seen they were wrong but there is still a significant support for Russia in that country even to this day.

If Trump remains influential in American politics then the world is that much less stable and safe.

Scarily people like you and millions of others are oblivious to this and simply believe the guff that you are fed.

The world IS changing - and not for the best.

observer


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

Sluffy wrote:

Oh God, every time I think you can't get anymore bonkers you post something like this and prove me wrong yet again.

NATO is the core basis of the western world's defence - to undermine it as he has emboldens crazies like Putin to attack.

Trump decided to withdraw US involvement from the middle east and it led directly to Russia filling the vacuum there.

Russia now has the sphere of influence with Syria, Iran, and the UAE that it never had before - Iran and the UAE are major players in avoiding sanctions and directly helping Russia in its war with Ukraine.

Trump unilaterally decided for HIS political reasons to bring home the troops from Afghanistan (and although the withdrawal to Trumps deadline took place under Biden) look at the tragedy for that country at what has since happened.

Trump has singlehandedly stopped the funding of arms to Ukraine and Ukraine are basically out of ammunition to defend themselves and consequently are in a bad way until something happens soon.

If Russia believes the USA won't help out if they attack Europe - then he will in the future attack it - initially the Baltic states which Putin believes like Ukraine is a part of Russia anyway!

Poland also in past history has been part of Russia and if he attacked them, then WE would be drawn into a war with Russia.

Do you believe that will never happen?

Well I believed a ground war in Europe would be unthinkable in this day and age  - but it is happening right now in Ukraine.


If Russia attacks and the USA does nothing where it is strongest (Europe), what do you think China might do in respect of Taiwan where logistically and geographically the USA is much weaker?

Ultimately who will protect western countries in that region such as Japan and Australia?

If the USA under Trump decides to become isolated from the rest of the world then it will effect the whole equilibrium of power across the globe.

These are not good things to happen.

Fwiw

Figure 4: NATO countries’ defence expenditure as a percentage of GDP (2015 prices), 2021

Donald Trump for President of the USA - Page 26 4
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/international-defence-expenditure-2022/finance-and-economics-annual-statistical-bulletin-international-defence-2022#nato-countries-defence-expenditure-as-a-percentage-of-gdp

NOTE - I'm pretty sure Germany in particular a few other countries have significantly stepped up their defence spending since Russia invaded Ukraine,


W63 you are likeable but you really, really are crazy if you believe in the guff you do - and unfortunately many in America clearly do to.
The only correction I can make from your post is that Trump is not doing it singlehandedly... albeit he is threatening the House Republicans and the Senate Republicans into turning down border security and aid to the Ukraine and Israel.  His hand picked House Speaker, Mike Johnson is his puppet in Congress who spouts "this is dead on arrival."  Trump is the puppet master and will turn into Hitler if elected.  Of course, his minions are rigging the nomination for him and there is little doubt that he will be the nominee of the Rethuglican Party. We can only hope that Trump is convicted before election day and is a convicted felon.  That does not mean he could not win the election, but polls indicate that a good portion of the voters would not support him upon conviction.  His cult following will always follow him.

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

Thank you Observer, nice to see you are still around and that I've been understanding most of what is been going on, on your side of the pond in respect of the undermining of global peace led by the megalomaniac Donald Trump.

I apologise if by using the wrong term for him above that I caused you to have the need to correct me, I did indeed intended to convey that Trump was the 'puppet master' rather than 'singlehanded', in all of this.

I note the 'package' has now cleared the Senate but I fear for its chances in Congress.

They say the road to Hell is paved with good intentions, well the expressway in which the American Republican party are racing us down towards it, seems to be completely good intention free.

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

Embarassed
boltonbonce wrote:
I assume you're  fine on him encouraging Russia to attack us?
Did I say that bonce? Maybe you should stop adding what you want into it and just stick to what I wrote. Trump has every right to call out those who don’t pay to enjoy the protection of the club.



Last edited by Whitesince63 on Tue Feb 13 2024, 15:39; edited 1 time in total

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

Whitesince63 wrote:Embarassed
boltonbonce wrote:
I assume you're  fine on him encouraging Russia to attack us?
Did I say that bonce? Maybe you should stop adding what you want into it and just stick to what I wrote. Trump has every right to call out those who don’t pay to enjoy the protection of the club.

???

Did you actually listen to what Trump said, 63?

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

If all the US has to offer is Trump and Biden then god help us all!

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

karlypants wrote:If all the US has to offer is Trump and Biden then god help us all!
They can have Sluffy if they want him. Someone who has the answer to everything, always right and no time to listen to anyone with an alternative view. Sounds just right. 😁

karlypants

karlypants
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Whitesince63 wrote:
karlypants wrote:If all the US has to offer is Trump and Biden then god help us all!
They can have Sluffy if they want him. Someone who has the answer to everything, always right and no time to listen to anyone with an alternative view. Sounds just right. 😁

Very Happy

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

Whitesince63 wrote:
karlypants wrote:If all the US has to offer is Trump and Biden then god help us all!
They can have Sluffy if they want him. Someone who has the answer to everything, always right and no time to listen to anyone with an alternative view. Sounds just right. 😁

I may not have the answers to everything but I do have a brain in my head and use it - which sets me apart from those who are led by the nose like you clearly are.



Have you listened to the video of Trump yet where he invites Russia to attack NATO countries, yet Strawman?

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

Texas Paul has it right.

Sluffy

Sluffy
Admin

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

boltonbonce wrote:Texas Paul has it right.

Sorry bonce I could only take so much of that. What a complete ranting divi it’s no wonder US politics is in such a mess! Still at least he can get most of his words out unlike Biden.

Whitesince63


Andy Walker
Andy Walker

Sluffy wrote:
All spoken by a crooked lying deceitful toad.

boltonbonce

boltonbonce
Nat Lofthouse
Nat Lofthouse

63, I'm done. You're a waste of intellectual space.

I could eat a bowl of alphabet soup and shit more sense.

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