How is the Tory Government Doing?

Whitesince63 wrote:because I know how much worse Labour would be.

You always spoil your posts with nonsense like this.

You don't know. I don't know. I doubt even Starmer knows.

But to be worse than Liz Truss would be spectacular.

Well all I can say is that if you do still think that Truss and Kwarty's (UNFUNDED) mini budget would have worked if they had prepared the ground for it better, then you are easily fooled.

May I remind you that Truss herself sacked Kwarty (who at the end of the day was carrying out HER financial polices) and replaced him by Hunt who DUMPED practically all of them and she still tried to cling on to being PM until the fiasco of the Fracking vote made her stay completely untenable.

Shows what sort of a person you voted in as PM and what grasp of government finances she had.

So I therefore stand by what I say, namely if you believe her financial policies were right, when even SHE DIDN'T and had to throw Kwarty under the bus and bring in Hunt to junk almost entirely ALL of HER OWN financial polices she was apparently so 'committed' to - whilst remember SHE WAS STILL IN OFFICE AS THE PRIME MINISTER - then yes I must know far more about government finances than you do considering I posted on here long before she won the race to be PM, that they would not work (and the fact Truss did the U turn WHILST Still IN OFFICE, or in other words, even SHE realised they would not work) and that the fact that even AFTER that you still stick by your belief that they would have done, shows that you do live in some sort of political rhetoric wonderland and NOT the real world.

I am NOT insulting or abusing you but rather stating the blindingly obvious truth of the matter, which apparently you are seemingly blissfully unaware of yourself.

Truss rejected her own financial policies whilst still as the PM, ffs!!!

Doesn't even that give you a hint they were wrong?

All the 'we should have prepared the ground better' is just claptrap to feed to the masses to believe - it simply isn't true.

The fatal flaw was the mini budget was UNFUNDED and they could have prepared the ground in advance as much as they liked but it wouldn't have made any ha'pence of difference because it still would have been UNFUNDED.

Even your dreaded enemy the Labour Government would never put a budget before Parliament that wasn't funded - yet you think they would do a worse job than Truss and Kwarty did...!!!

I've got confidence in Rishi, Truss however was an absolute car crash - and you still think she was going in the right direction???

God help you if you really do.

Sluffy wrote:Well all I can say is that if you do still think that Truss and Kwarty's (UNFUNDED) mini budget would have worked if they had prepared the ground for it better, then you are easily fooled.  

May I remind you that Truss herself sacked Kwarty (who at the end of the day was carrying out HER financial polices) and replaced him by Hunt who DUMPED practically all of them and she still tried to cling on to being PM until the fiasco of the Fracking vote made her stay completely untenable.

Shows what sort of a person you voted in as PM and what grasp of government finances she had.

So I therefore stand by what I say, namely if you believe her financial policies were right, when even SHE DIDN'T and had to throw Kwarty under the bus and bring in Hunt to junk almost entirely ALL of HER OWN financial polices she was apparently so 'committed' to - whilst remember SHE WAS STILL IN OFFICE AS THE PRIME MINISTER - then yes I must know far more about government finances than you do considering I posted on here long before she won the race to be PM, that they would not work (and the fact Truss did the U turn WHILST Still IN OFFICE, or in other words, even SHE realised they would not work) and that the fact that even AFTER that you still stick by your belief that they would have done, shows that you do live in some sort of political rhetoric wonderland and NOT the real world.

I am NOT insulting or abusing you but rather stating the blindingly obvious truth of the matter, which apparently you are seemingly blissfully unaware of yourself.

Truss rejected her own financial policies whilst still as the PM, ffs!!!

Doesn't even that give you a hint they were wrong?

All the 'we should have prepared the ground better' is just claptrap to feed to the masses to believe - it simply isn't true.

The fatal flaw was the mini budget was UNFUNDED and they could have prepared the ground in advance as much as they liked but it wouldn't have made any ha'pence of difference because it still would have been UNFUNDED.

Even your dreaded enemy the Labour Government would never put a budget before Parliament that wasn't funded - yet you think they would do a worse job than Truss and Kwarty did...!!!

I've got confidence in Rishi, Truss however was an absolute car crash - and you still think she was going in the right direction???

God help you if you really do.

Sluffy, on your high horse again. Just for once would you actually read a post before you make inaccurate comments deriding it? I agreed it was a car crash but the elements she proposed in her leadership campaign were agreed by virtually everyone and if she’d stuck to them, as Sunak is now doing, there wouldn’t have been any issue. She didn’t, she went far too far but even then, to sack Kwasi rather than just roll back on the proposals was wrong and she should have fallen on her sword.

That doesn’t though mean that the direction she was going in was wrong. Even on fracking she was right. Gas emits only 30% of the carbon emissions of coal and the widely accepted consensus is that moving towards gas generation and away from coal will be massively beneficial to climate change. Had we been able to produce the gas available it would have both secured our energy security as well as provided much needed well paid jobs plus a valuable export commodity. Yes, of course we need to have a genuine grown up discussion on the rights and wrongs and safety fears first but we’ve never had that, just the anti fracking brigade nutcases spouting nonsense.

This country is heading for the dogs unless a truly Conservative government takes the reins. Maybe it does need a dose of true Labour to let people see how really bad things can get but personally I’d rather not go there. If we keep on this path though we certainly will and for all Rishi’s steadying hand he won’t win an election I’m afraid.

I honestly don't know why you keep obsessing about Brexit?

Yes we all know it has been a disater.

Yes we all know the experts at the time predicted this BUT...

...the public (including YOU don't forget) voted FOR Brexit, THREE times (the Referendum, the EU elections and the 2019 General Election) and set the mandate for the government to do so.

The EU set the harshest of terms for us to leave - which of course they had every right to do - they did not want us to leave - and that is why we find ourselves in the position we are now.

To return to the EU will mean all 27 EU countries will have to vote in favour of our return and that is unlikely to happen with rogue country's such as Hungary (with its Russian connections) unlikely to support our application.

As shit as it is, we are where we are and have no choice other to accept it and try to make the best of it as we can.

I really don't think posting your hatred for it daily for the last three years is going to change a single thing AND it certainly won't get us back into the EU.

Why do you keep on obsessing about it - particularly as YOU VOTED FOR BREXIT IN THE FIRST PLACE???

Whitesince63 wrote:
Sluffy, on your high horse again. Just for once would you actually read a post before you make inaccurate comments deriding it? I agreed it was a car crash but the elements she proposed in her leadership campaign were agreed by virtually everyone and if she’d stuck to them, as Sunak is now doing, there wouldn’t have been any issue. She didn’t, she went far too far but even then, to sack Kwasi rather than just roll back on the proposals was wrong and she should have fallen on her sword.

That doesn’t though mean that the direction she was going in was wrong. Even on fracking she was right. Gas emits only 30% of the carbon emissions of coal and the widely accepted consensus is that moving towards gas generation and away from coal will be massively beneficial to climate change. Had we been able to produce the gas available it would have both secured our energy security as well as provided much needed well paid jobs plus a valuable export commodity. Yes, of course we need to have a genuine grown up discussion on the rights and wrongs and safety fears first but we’ve never had that, just the anti fracking brigade nutcases spouting nonsense.

This country is heading for the dogs unless a truly Conservative government takes the reins. Maybe it does need a dose of true Labour to let people see how really bad things can get but personally I’d rather not go there. If we keep on this path though we certainly will and for all Rishi’s steadying hand he won’t win an election I’m afraid.

???

Are you for real 63?

Rishi correctly predicted before Truss won the leadership campaign that her economic views were absolutely wrong - if you don't believe me pick any of these numerous reports about it...

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=sunak+truss+economic+policy&source=hp&ei=LEJeY-bzJNCJ8gLx86TgBw&iflsig=AJiK0e8AAAAAY15QPFBdWMvsNP-bVkK2-qlAQ0WDMw3W&oq=sunak+truss+eco&gs_lcp=Cgdnd3Mtd2l6EAEYADIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIGCAAQFhAeMgYIABAWEB4yBggAEBYQHjIJCAAQFhAeEMcDMgUIABCGAzIFCAAQhgM6EQguEI8BEI8BEOoCEIwDEOUCOhEIABCPARCPARDqAhCMAxDlAjoRCC4QgAQQsQMQgwEQxwEQ0QM6CAgAELEDEIMBOg4ILhCABBCxAxDHARDRAzoUCC4QgAQQsQMQgwEQxwEQ0QMQ1AI6CwgAEIAEELEDEIMBOgsILhCABBCxAxCDAToICC4QsQMQgwE6DggAEIAEELEDEIMBEMkDOhEILhCABBCxAxCDARDHARCvAToFCC4QgAQ6DQgAEIAEELEDELEDEAo6CwguEIAEEMcBEK8BOgcIABCABBADUOcKWKFXYPN8aAFwAHgAgAFuiAGXB5IBBDE0LjGYAQCgAQGwAQo&sclient=gws-wiz

As for fracking -

Fracking won’t work in UK says founder of fracking company Cuadrilla

Chris Cornelius says geology is too challenging and government’s support is merely ‘soundbites’

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/sep/21/fracking-wont-work-uk-founder-chris-cornelius-cuadrilla

Rishi Sunak brings back fracking ban in first PMQs

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-63402777

You might believe me to be on my high horse but I'm not the one making inaccurate comments - it's you!!!

A number 5 - excellent

Ok Sluffy, not much point continuing to counter each other, I think you’re missing the essence of what I’m saying or maybe it’s just me that isn’t explaining it very well. I think we can both agree that Truss messed up big time but Rishi is actually only doing what Liz predicted she’d do other than the extras she added in the mini budget and only time will tell if he’s right but clearly the markets are happy at the moment so let’s wait and see.

Looks like things are hotting up for Braverman after the official HM Prisons Inspectorate* report on Manston revealed that there are outbreaks of scabies and diptheria relating to the inhumane conditions and massive overcrowding inside.

Numbers have risen to over 4000 people - and as they are supposed to be processed within 24 hours, there are no beds, open toilets and no access to fresh air.

Some, including young children have been there for over a month.

* Prisons Inspectorate? Is it a prison or a refugee centre? Or a gulag?

wanderlust wrote:Looks like things are hotting up for Braverman after the official HM Prisons Inspectorate* report on Manston revealed that there are outbreaks of scabies and diptheria relating to the inhumane conditions and massive overcrowding inside.

Numbers have risen to over 4000 people - and as they are supposed to be processed within 24 hours, there are no beds, open toilets and no access to fresh air.

Some, including young children have been there for over a month.

* Prisons Inspectorate? Is it a prison or a refugee centre? Or a gulag?

Another almost 2000 arrived over the weekend so why is it a surprise that the place is becoming overcrowded? The numbers of these people coming is rising exponentially whilst the number of places to send them to is becoming more and more difficult as hotels themselves become full. Nobody wants to see the problem at Manston including Braverman I’m sure but what exactly do you expect her to do about it with nowhere to send them? Instead of just criticising all the time why don’t you suggest what to do with these people because Labour couldn’t in the commons yesterday,just like you, moan, moan, moan.

Suella could make a start by filling every hotel in Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford.

Whitesince63 wrote:
Another almost 2000 arrived over the weekend so why is it a surprise that the place is becoming overcrowded? The numbers of these people coming is rising exponentially whilst the number of places to send them to is becoming more and more difficult as hotels themselves become full. Nobody wants to see the problem at Manston including Braverman I’m sure but what exactly do you expect her to do about it with nowhere to send them? Instead of just criticising all the time why don’t you suggest what to do with these people because Labour couldn’t in the commons yesterday,just like you, moan, moan, moan.

The Immigration system has been under Tory control for 12 years and they've broken it. Simply put, if they had invested the relatively minor costs of boosting the "clearing house" system so that immigrants could still be "processed" in 24 hours, the punitive costs of housing them would be slashed but they didn't.
It's one thing to say they wish to control immigration but putting the people and systems in place to keep up with demand is another thing altogether. It is criminal that we have worker shortages and jobs for legitimate refugees - industry is desperate - and a government that hasn't put the system in place to separate them from economic migrants and criminals so that they can boost our economy and start paying taxes at the earliest possible time.

Furthermore recent events have proven beyond doubt that all the Tory bluster and threats about deportation to Africa etc has had absolutely ZERO effect on demand and wasting taxpayer's money on ineffective soundbite policies deprives the UK of the means to actually deal with it in a way that benefits UK PLC.

Everyone SHOULD be moaning so that we can get these incompetents out of power asap.

Rishi's dog gets my vote.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-11374649/RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN-Ive-never-known-political-class-touch-people.html

Ten Bobsworth wrote:Rishi's dog gets my vote.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-11374649/RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN-Ive-never-known-political-class-touch-people.html

Never heard Suella called that before.

wanderlust wrote:
Never heard Suella called that before.

Did you go to Bash Street, Lusty? You so remind me of Smiffy, the kid that always gets things wrong.

Anyroad the dogs a labrador retriever called Nova. Suella seems to me to be a bit of a terrier.

But if you'd rather have a Pixie Balls-Cooper for companionship don't let me deter you.

Poor Kia.

wanderlust wrote:
The Immigration system has been under Tory control for 12 years and they've broken it. Simply put, if they had invested the relatively minor costs of boosting the "clearing house" system so that immigrants could still be "processed" in 24 hours, the punitive costs of housing them would be slashed but they didn't.
It's one thing to say they wish to control immigration but putting the people and systems in place to keep up with demand is another thing altogether. It is criminal that we have worker shortages and jobs for legitimate refugees - industry is desperate - and a government that hasn't put the system in place to separate them from economic migrants and criminals so that they can boost our economy and start paying taxes at the earliest possible time.

Furthermore recent events have proven beyond doubt that all the Tory bluster and threats about deportation to Africa etc has had absolutely ZERO effect on demand and wasting taxpayer's money on ineffective soundbite policies deprives the UK of the means to actually deal with it in a way that benefits UK PLC.

Everyone SHOULD be moaning so that we can get these incompetents out of power asap.

We are where we are now Lusty and the Manston situation is a recent event so what the Tory’s did over 12 years, however much I may agree with you, is irrelevant. I asked you where you would house the migrants increasingly coming in illegally. As usual you don’t answer, just drift off into another diatribe of how wicked the Tory’s are. Just tell me where you’d put them if not in Manston.

Whitesince63 wrote:
We are where we are now Lusty and the Manston situation is a recent event so what the Tory’s did over 12 years, however much I may agree with you, is irrelevant. I asked you where you would house the migrants increasingly coming in illegally. As usual you don’t answer, just drift off into another diatribe of how wicked the Tory’s are. Just tell me where you’d put them if not in Manston.

I wouldn't house illegal migrants at all White - you're barking up the wrong tree again.

If the immigration system was functioning properly I'd do what the law says - they'd be checked out in 24 hours and if they're illegal i.e. don't qualify as bona fide refugees or meet other legal criteria for entry they have no right to be here.
Simple system for illegals. Park them on a "country of origin" ship offshore with zero benefits and basic food and medical care until there's enough to make the journey back financially viable for UK PLC. The UK has operated prison ships before and they're far cheaper than conventional prisons and hotels. I wouldn't necessarily be against the idea of setting up the ships as modern day workhouses so they could make a financial contribution towards their own deportment as that would send a very strong message to anyone thinking of taking the piss.

For legal immigrants they either have a job or family to come to or they're given a job i.e. no freeloaders. And no access to state medical services and benefits unless they've paid taxes.

Legal migrants we should welcome with open arms. Illegal migrants should get short shrift - but without a functioning filtering system we're f****d which is the point I made.

wanderlust wrote:
I wouldn't house illegal migrants at all White - you're barking up the wrong tree again.

If the immigration system was functioning properly I'd do what the law says - they'd be checked out in 24 hours and if they're illegal i.e. don't qualify as bona fide refugees or meet other legal criteria for entry they have no right to be here.
Simple system for illegals. Park them on a "country of origin" ship offshore with zero benefits and basic food and medical care until there's enough to make the journey back financially viable for UK PLC. The UK has operated prison ships before and they're far cheaper than conventional prisons and hotels. I wouldn't necessarily be against the idea of setting up the ships as modern day workhouses so they could make a financial contribution towards their own deportment as that would send a very strong message to anyone thinking of taking the piss.

For legal immigrants they either have a job or family to come to or they're given a job i.e. no freeloaders. And no access to state medical services and benefits unless they've paid taxes.

Legal migrants we should welcome with open arms. Illegal migrants should get short shrift - but without a functioning filtering system we're f****d which is the point I made.

Yet more pie in the sky nonsense from you Lusty. Do you seriously believe that once they’ve landed they wouldn’t be protected by our insane legal brigade and woke groups to stop them being removed, even if they don’t have a legal right to be here? It’s happening now. Suggesting the use of prison ships or decommissioned liners is just ridiculous, it won’t happen and nor should it.

What you’re suggesting is common sense and logic, that if they don’t have a right to be here then they should be immediately removed but there are too many vested interests intent on preventing that. It’s a total mess but as long as these bleeding hearts continue to exasperate the situation it won’t be revolved. Under the rules, any Albanians arriving here should already be immediately sent back because they don’t meet any of the criteria for asylum. Let’s see if the Tory’s can achieve that but I have my doubts the invasion can be ceased.

Whitesince63 wrote:
Yet more pie in the sky nonsense from you Lusty. Do you seriously believe that once they’ve landed they wouldn’t be protected by our insane legal brigade and woke groups to stop them being removed, even if they don’t have a legal right to be here? It’s happening now. Suggesting the use of prison ships or decommissioned liners is just ridiculous, it won’t happen and nor should it.

What you’re suggesting is common sense and logic, that if they don’t have a right to be here then they should be immediately removed but there are too many vested interests intent on preventing that. It’s a total mess but as long as these bleeding hearts continue to exasperate the situation it won’t be revolved. Under the rules, any Albanians arriving here should already be immediately sent back because they don’t meet any of the criteria for asylum. Let’s see if the Tory’s can achieve that but I have my doubts the invasion can be ceased.

You can save your rhetoric for the idiots who live on a diet of propaganda and xenophobic cliches White because it's inaccurate and irrelevant.

Fact is that only 4% of the people arriving by small boat in 2021 have had a decision.

FOUR PERCENT! And that's last years arrivals -96% are still here! Plus this year's.

That's the problem in a nutshell White - inefficiency and incompetence - and the facts prove it. It's almost as if our government is intentionally holding them captive and is willing to pay through the nose to do it.

It's not fair on us and it's not fair on them so if you are concerned about the number of illegal immigrants on our shores complain to the government and stop voting Tory - the party that worsens the crisis.

wanderlust wrote: Moan, moan, bitch, moan.....and so on and so on, ceaselessly and unendingly.

The real reasons seem to be that the numbers arriving haven't been able to be dealt with because there are simply more of them than the staff to deal with them (plus the administration systems to deal with them simply aren't fit for purpose) causing a bottleneck with vastly increasing numbers more arriving than have ever arrived before.

It isn't planned as Wanderlust somehow seems to believe it is, it isn't inefficiency as such, it is just that the system (and staffing levels) simply aren't able to cope with the vast influx of new immigrants entering the country illegally.

In 2020 the system was struggling to deal with 10,000 cases per year - in just the last two years 70,000 illegal immigrants have arrived.

It's no wonder there are backups really is it?


Oh and prison ships...

Hahahaha!!!!




What's behind the Home Office migrant backlog?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63477371